What most advice threads look like to me

[mikee]

Guys, I need some help with blaster casters; I just can't seem to get one off the ground. My melee tank runs are much better because I can go sword and board hyperviolence on all the droogs, with okatrog abilities as a HUGE panic button to rely on. However, when I play blaster casters, I seem to run out of mp all the time and have hunger problems. I also never seem to have luck finding a good resistance stick to wield, although one time I did find a nice -6 flail with rpois. What do you think I should do?

[Sandman25]

Well, I don't get the sarcasm if it is present. Is your point that melee characters are bad for teaching new players because they allow to win with bad tactics?

[Pollen_Golem]

I think what mikee is saying is that when people try magic builds, they typically do it with a wrong-headed approach that is all too common, which incorporates an unhealthy mix of both preconceptions from other games and calcified tactics learned from playing melee builds.

[celem]

Yeah thats how I read that one too. Theres this pre-conception that when you do 'blaster' (and just having a term for it is indicative of such problems) that you should be like the melee-monster, just flipped toward magic. As much spellcasting as possible for mana, throw the biggest spells you can, using magic to kill everything that enters the screen. These are all poor ideas, but fairly logical if coming from another fantasy style game, where such 'pure' mages are actually viable.

Its generalisations like the ones I put in quotes above that cause these threads, they either read shit advice, or just genuinely thought it works that way.
For what its worth i'v never made a 'pure' anything, and find the term hybrid to be misleading since every crawl character is hybrid. Even your MiBe trog is going to footle about with a rod or wand at some point (or thrown, which is conjurations that uses consumable ammo rather than MP), and the DeWz/Cj will likewise need to draw a pointed stick sooner or later. (hint: sooner)

It may be possible to win with such polarised characters, doesnt mean its optimal.

I reckon Sandman25 is close to the mark. I know the berserker is a popular recommendation for a first character, I would never recommend such to a friend, its a polarised character type and you will never play another (non-Be) like it. I might well recommend Fi/Gl as fairly simple, mainly melee starts that will later become a more generic (well-rounded) crawl character.

I bet about 50% of the problems newer players have with blaster casters are because the rest of us insist on saying blaster caster all the damn time.

[Turukano]

Guys, I need some help with blaster casters; I just can't seem to get one off the ground.

Alright, I wrote a guide for you.

However, when I play blaster casters, I seem to run out of mp all the time

You can get more MP if you focus on spellcasting and turn everything else off. Also, a ring of magical power or a staff of power will increase your MP. If you don't find one of these on D:1 - D:4 just press ctrl-Q and restart the game until you get one.

and have hunger problems.

One way to deal with this is training spellcasting exclusively to 27. Another way is to start as a mummy, mummies don't have any hunger issues and are easy to play.

I also never seem to have luck finding a good resistance stick to wield

That's bad luck for sure. The +0 club "MasterBlaster" {rN+ Dex-5 stl--} is quite common on D:1 and provides you with one of the most important resists in the early game.

although one time I did find a nice -6 flail with rpois.

Keep this weapon and train polearms. rPois stacks with poison immunity of your mummy.

What do you think I should do?

Start as DEWz and worship Trog. You can kill most of your foes with magic darts. If you get in trouble you can go berserk as backup. Your -6 flail "KillThemAll" {rPois} will do a good job.

[Sandman25]

Start as DEWz and worship Trog. You can kill most of your foes with magic darts. If you get in trouble you can go berserk as backup. Your -6 flail "KillThemAll" {rPois} will do a good job.

No, magic dart is bad, use UC from turn 1.

[Arrhythmia]

OP have you heard the good word of Dith?

[nago]

OP have you heard the good word of Dith?

This is probably the funniest post I've read in a while - although probably you were ironic, I can't grasp it for certain

[zrn]

hyperviolence on all the droogs

Give it to them in the yarbles, then a bit of the old in-out, in-out. That should solve your mp problems.

[archaeo]

In this somewhat tepidly written but competent undergraduate thesis, the authors discuss the way in which slang has developed within the "gaming community" at large and in the separate subcommunities surrounding various games. Here's something that may be applicable:

Because experience is associated with skill level, newer players sometimes make efforts to mask their inexperience through use of slang terms. However, overuse of slang terms by newer players is also common, and ironically is also an indicator of apparent inexperience or an attempt to seem more knowledgeable than one actually is.

[mps]

Interestingly, this is exactly what most sneering irc coolguy commentary looks like to me.

[XuaXua]

...

Somehow it's expected for one to write their undergraduate thesis on video gaming if one's last name is Kong.

[dowan]

Guys, I need some help with blaster casters; I just can't seem to get one off the ground. My melee tank runs are much better because I can go sword and board hyperviolence on all the droogs, with okatrog abilities as a HUGE panic button to rely on. However, when I play blaster casters, I seem to run out of mp all the time and have hunger problems. I also never seem to have luck finding a good resistance stick to wield, although one time I did find a nice -6 flail with rpois. What do you think I should do?

Care to give an example of a post like this made within the last year or so? Because I read almost every advice thread and I've only ever seen 1 or 2 that approach this level of silliness. However I had assumed this was pretty much what you thought of pretty much all the other crawl players, except a few other 'elites'.


EDIT: This is clearly not actually a post looking for advice, mods please move to CYC before actual new players see what the vets around here think of them.

[Sar]

why would new players care about what vets think

do you really think we have animals playing Crawl and posting on Tavern?

[Sandman25]

By the way, why don't we have gods with huge panic button for casters? The only reliable god with summons is Trog, there is no god who gives +50% MP as long as you are doing nothing but casting spells, temporary +5 skill levels to magic or 0.5 turn per cast is missing too (Ash is too late and the bonus is less).

[Sar]

there's Chei!

[Sandman25]

there's Chei!

Good joke.

[Sar]

I thought you liked Chei? And it sounds exactly like what you are asking for - a great boost to spellcasting (+15 Int!) and a powerful panic button.

[pickled_heretic]

improved mp regen and/or cost reduction is also missing from item generation, and I think this is one of the biggest faults.

[Pollen_Golem]

By the way, why don't we have gods with huge panic button for casters?

I suppose the magic-aligned gods expect their followers to come up with their own huge panic buttons.

[Sandman25]

I thought you liked Chei? And it sounds exactly like what you are asking for - a great boost to spellcasting (+15 Int!) and a powerful panic button.

I like Chei but it is the second worst god for pure casters, right after Trog. Pure casters cannot rely on MP alone because MP regeneration is really slow so pure caster must run away or channel mana. Chei prevents running away and does not give a way to channel MP. Also Chei's panic buttons require huge amount of MP (10 MP for Step from Time - more than level 9 spell, 3 MP for Bend Time when Slow costs 2, 5 MP for Slouch). I will post Anti-Trog God proposal in CYC soon, I have some ideas.

[and into]

EDIT: This is clearly not actually a post looking for advice, mods please move to CYC before actual new players see what the vets around here think of them.

DCA is also fine for giving general advice, but yes, this thread belongs in CYC.

Mods get to these things faster if you report the post, though, just for future reference. We have a handy tool that shows us all reports and the threads to which they belong, and that's the first thing I (and probably most other mods) check after logging in.

[apparentbliss]

#greaterplayerproblems

[tasonir]

Chei is also more of a generalist god - if you go "pure caster" you're likely not benefiting from the 15 str, and not getting as much benefit from the dex as a more hybrid character does.

Edit: Half-baked anti-trog idea moved to anti-trog thread.

[Rast]

The +15 STR lets you wear better armor while still being able to cast.

[Lasty]

Guys, I need some help with blaster casters; I just can't seem to get one off the ground.

No problem, I can help. First, you need to consider which mid-game equipment you'll be using, and plan for that. Next, learn my favorite niche, expensive spell. wait until the temple to worship one of two different possible gods; you could worship the other one but it's much worse. If you ever get below 50% mp and don't yet have a crystal ball, retreat upstairs and rest. If anyone suggests a weapon remind them that you're a blaster caster.

[tasonir]

improved mp regen and/or cost reduction is also missing from item generation, and I think this is one of the biggest faults.

While you're out of luck on cost reduction, mp regen technically does exist - a ring of magical power gives you +9 mana, and mana regen is based strictly off max mana. While that +9 isn't terribly huge past the early game, going from 40 to 49 mana is still ~17% faster regen*, though. The bigger issue for me is that if you hit 50 natural mana, now the ring gets cut in half, and you're at less than 10% faster regen. A separate ring of mana regen would prevent you from losing a mana regen boost because you hit the max mana soft cap.

*I believe the mana regen formula is max mana + 14 per X turns, correct me if I'm wrong. Not sure what X is, but that doesn't matter here, I think it is around 100 turns?

[n1000]

use your most powerful attack and heal when necessary

[Lasty]

now the ring gets cut in half

Not anymore!