Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem


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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 15:42

Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

In Dwarf Fortress, you have to maintain a certain balance to allow your dwarves to survive (until something stronger drops by for a visit).

In Crawl, the monsters simply hang around in the dungeon, waiting for the player to show up. Sure, there are a few traps here and there, but there isn't really anything too cohesive or inter-floor communication, or "sustainability" of the dungeon denizen's lifestyles. Yet, we have many herding animals, some beehives, and several other food sources. There are many vaults themed around food (my favorite being the hydra / kobold one), where farming or cooking is implied.

Dismissing Pan/Abyss/Hells for now, how can a Crawl dungeon be emulated sustainably within a Dwarf Fortress-style context if it had to be done in this manner in order to guard the Orb of Zot from players?

I would assume that farms would be set up in Lair and around the D entrance to Lair, with Elf/Orc/Goblin/Kobold runners delivering food to various outposts and floors, as well as several mostly-controlled bee hives.
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Halls Hopper

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 15:54

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

The best food-related vault by far was the old pack of hungry kobolds guarding the batch of halfling children. I miss silly-flavour text monster variants. As for explaining how any of this functions, you'd have to assume a very heavy flood of adventurers to explain the Depths, and that causes trouble for spriggans, what with their herbivorocity. Unless lots of vine stalkers descend...

I'm going to assume that all of Zot has been kept in temporal stasis until you insert the three runes. It's an absolutely fixed system in there, so the draconians can't really be explained otherwise. All of Lair can be explained as a massive photosynthesis-based ecology that self-sustains and provides for its easy branches. Orc is explained by its Spider-farming attempts, which we can assume work more often than not; we just HAPPEN to find the disastrous farms... The Slime Pits are fine, since we know most jellies are capable of eating metal, and the gradually melting walls should reveal tasty ore now and then. So what's that leave us with, Elf and the Depths?
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:06

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

Giant Orange Brainbow Dash wrote:The best food-related vault by far was the old pack of hungry kobolds guarding the batch of halfling children.


They replaced the halflings with lizards recently.

I miss silly-flavour text monster variants. As for explaining how any of this functions, you'd have to assume a very heavy flood of adventurers to explain the Depths, and that causes trouble for spriggans, what with their herbivorocity. Unless lots of vine stalkers descend...


As stated previously; farms in and around Lair, with Orc (or lesser) food-runners delivering food to other floors. We also have the Spriggan baker concept (which may actually involve other spriggans...).

Beyond food, we also have inter-species diplomacy to consider.
Gnolls pack and sometimes lead goblins.
Goblins and Kobolds also inter-mix.
Sometimes we find Kobolds and Gnolls with Orcs.
Obviously the Orcs guard the Elves, and the Orcs associate with the higher beings (Ogres, Trolls, Giants, and their kin).
Men and *taurs (and their crypts) are in and around the vaults.
Draconians tend to venture outside out of Zot, so it is not entirely closed.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:12

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

Giant Orange Brainbow Dash wrote:photosynthesis


~10-20 dungeon levels away from the sun, this might be problematic
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:13

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

cerebovssquire wrote:
Giant Orange Brainbow Dash wrote:photosynthesis


~10-20 dungeon levels away from the sun, this might be problematic


We do have to consider that something is creating light and... islands. Spider is implied next to Orc (based on the failed break-in attempts). Alternately, we have Swamp/Shoals. Are these portals to pocket imensions?
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:30

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

XuaXua wrote:They replaced the halflings with lizards recently.

This is literally the worst thing.

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Swamp Slogger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:39

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

XuaXua wrote:
cerebovssquire wrote:
Giant Orange Brainbow Dash wrote:photosynthesis


~10-20 dungeon levels away from the sun, this might be problematic


We do have to consider that something is creating light and... islands. Spider is implied next to Orc (based on the failed break-in attempts). Alternately, we have Swamp/Shoals. Are these portals to pocket imensions?

Fedhas creates light and water.
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Blades Runner

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:41

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

cerebovssquire wrote:
Giant Orange Brainbow Dash wrote:photosynthesis


~10-20 dungeon levels away from the sun, this might be problematic


microscopic perpetual motion machines in the soil provide energy

i imagine you'd also need a network of chutes to deliver food quickly to lower levels, or we'd need caravans going around branches.

of course, if we're implementing all this we'd also need a dwarf fortress branch somewhere in the dungeon. probably somewhere in depths. with a chained up forgotten beast somewhere deep inside.
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Halls Hopper

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:51

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

A branch full of heavily armoured hill dwarf lunatics that either berserk or go suicidal or strip naked and became perpetually confused any time they see another hill dwarf die. Expect instantly lethal traps, goblin skeletons in every open square, an inherent Corpse Rot spell that triggers branch-wide every 20 turns in order to generate miasma from corpses, and a 5% chance that the entire branch is flooded with deep water / lava tiles before you even get there.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 16:55

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

Lyrick wrote:
cerebovssquire wrote:
Giant Orange Brainbow Dash wrote:photosynthesis


~10-20 dungeon levels away from the sun, this might be problematic


microscopic perpetual motion machines in the soil provide energy


this sounds like a prog rock lyric

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 19:02

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

cerebovssquire wrote:
Lyrick wrote:
cerebovssquire wrote:~10-20 dungeon levels away from the sun, this might be problematic


microscopic perpetual motion machines in the soil provide energy


this sounds like a prog rock lyric


Probably a line stolen from Voivod.
...MiAK}TeAMDrIE{FoVMVSFi}{MuVMGhGlVpMo}HaWrSpWz{OgGlTrMo}{CeWnMfBeMiSk}DrEE{GrFiFoGl}
DgEnFeNe{OpGlHuSu}DDArHaCKSpAEGrTmDgFEDsCjGhMoHuVM{HaAMBaEn}{HuMoHOWn}DsWzDDHu
{DgWnGnBe}FeIE{MiEnMfCj}SpNeBaEEGrFE{HaAKTrCK}DsFESpHu{FoArNaBe}FeEE{HOIEMiAE}GrGlHuWr
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 19:28

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

Sprucery wrote:
cerebovssquire wrote:
Lyrick wrote:microscopic perpetual motion machines in the soil provide energy


this sounds like a prog rock lyric


Probably a line stolen from Voivod.


Or TMBG.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Joined: Thursday, 10th February 2011, 18:30

Post Monday, 12th January 2015, 20:47

Re: Crawl as a Dwarf Fortress-style ecosystem

So... besides playing the adventure-mode of Dwarf Fortress, is there a procedurally-generated RogueLike that tries to make an intelligently-designed / ecosystem-style dungeon?
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