Titan

[bcadren]

Simplified boiled down !boring version of a huge race. Keeps the core of the earlier 'tree race' and 'jotunn' without major gimmicks. Meant to be the !basic huge race, like hu is for normal size; og is for large and ha is for small. Titan are also magic affine for a large race and often choose to be elementalists.

Stats:
STR 22 INT 8 DEX 2
Gains 1 STR every 2 levels.

Weirdness/Mutations:
Base Stealth of 6
Base Size of -8
Cannot use armour except Robes and Dragon Armour.
Cannot use shields except Large Shields.
Cannot wear gloves, boots, hats or helmets.
Can wield 2H weapons 1H.
Shield penalties are somewhat higher than normal; but can be removed with 12 Shields.
Your huge size gives you a multiplicative slaying bonus, which scales with your current STR. You do (100 + STR/2)% of normal damage [Max 125%.]
All the above are related to being dragon sized.
Tough Skin III.

Start Changes:
Shields are replaced with Large Shields.
Hats are removed.
Starting Armour is always a robe.

Apts.
Fighting: +2, Short: -4*, Long: -1, Axes: -1, Maces: -1, Polearms: -1, Staves: 1, Slings: -4*, Bows: -1, xBows: -2, Throw: +3!, Armour: 2, Dodge: 1, Stealth: 0, Shields: -1, UC: 0,
Splcast: 1, Conj: 1, Hexes: 0, Charms: 2, Summ: 1, Nec: 2, Tloc: -2, Tmut: -1, Fire: 2!, Ice: 2!, Air: 2, Earth: 2, Poison: 1, Inv: 1, Evo: 0, Exp: -3*, HP: 5!, MP: -1

Preferred Backgrounds:
Fighter, Hunter, Berserker, Abyssal Knight, Death Knight, Healer, Transmuter, Arcane Marksman, Wizard, Fire Elementalist, Ice Elementalist, Air Elementalist, Earth Elementalist.

Prefer Weapon choice:
war axe, trident, flail, bow, large rocks

[TeshiAlair]

Jesus christ those starting weapons

[Lasty]

This race is can start with (effectively) a demon blade of (freezing|flaming) and also 50% increased HP. If the goal of the race is to ensure that it is literally impossible to die before Depths, you've probably succeeded.

[tasonir]

With absolutely no equipment slots except for dragon armor/robes, I think we've found a use case for dragon form. 50% more of 50% more hp, then you quaff a potion of berserk rage, and poof, 800 hp. I'm down. And it won't kill your EV any more than it already was, so...

I like the race, it's simple and clean for the most part. Letting them learn elemental magic at a reasonable rate is a nice touch. I think the only issue is really the starting weapons. How they treat 1h-2h weapons might need some adjusting, and be careful to not steal too much from Fo. Although I don't think it's too terrible if two races share something, most people seem dead set against it.

Update: Also, I'm not sure we really want to remove all ranged weapons but longbows. I understand you're trying to get some sort of flavor across, but it's just bad mechanics. Let them use ranged weapons if they like.

[and into]

If you species proposal requires major, game-altering substitutions for 13 of the existing backgrounds, maybe you should consider that a problem with the design of your species, rather than thinking, "Hey, we can just shoehorn in three or four entirely new weapons solely for the purpose of adding this species."

[DracheReborn]

If you species proposal requires major, game-altering substitutions for 13 of the existing backgrounds, maybe you should consider that a problem with the design of your species, rather than thinking, "Hey, we can just shoehorn in three or four entirely new weapons solely for the purpose of adding this species."

Especially so when this can be avoided simply by letting giants use 1H weapons like everyone else; IMO it's not a meaningful restriction.

As I pointed out in IRC, 2H as 1H is already Fo's gimmick. Nothing else about giant/titan size seems interesting.

[bcadren]

Updated a fair amount. Several of the weapon apts are now as bad as trolls and deep elves. Aimed for a (-2 [Demigod level]) average with the race being better at magic than fighting and all the innate bonuses affecting fighting, but requiring significant investment to use. Got rid of the 1H weapon restriction and boosted STR to huge levels (though other stats are still humanly). -3 Fight will set a new minimum for that apt; while the rest are within existing boundaries.

[Bloax]

The reasoning for the shit weapon aptitudes being the fact that the humongous Str and the x1.25 damage multiplier make them do quite a bunch of damage with weapons, albeit with the cost of reaching the maximum potential taking some time. (And oh noes, a really tough caster race.)

[Lasty]

I would think that a race this huge would be very good at crushing things in its giant fists; why are the UC and Fighting apts so low? It seems comical to imagine something so immense using even two-handed human weapons when their own fists would necessarily be so much more formidable.

[Hopeless]

The aptitudes floored me. The only thing Giants are good at skill-wise are Elemental magics? That seems so against fantasy lore in general that I am flabbergasted. In particular I'd expect non-negative aptitudes for Longblades, Axes and M&F and Polearms as well as Throwing. Id also expect them to be good at Armor or at least not super bad at it.

The commentary about the 1h restriction also seems dead on. Why? Just to make them unique? Seems arbitrary. My thinking is: instead apply penalties to acc and damage when wielding them if you think they need balancing. Also why not include new items: Giant Shields and Tower Shields?

Also why don't they have natural Reach? (I know the mechanism of this sucks but hey that is a separate issues.)

Giants could also because of their tremendous size use a quake ability that does damage to the terrain with the possibilty of stunning and confusing those within range and calling any mobs not so near to the locus of the ability. (This is probably outlandish but flavor-wise makes sense to me.)

[bcadren]

I would think that a race this huge would be very good at crushing things in its giant fists; why are the UC and Fighting apts so low? It seems comical to imagine something so immense using even two-handed human weapons when their own fists would necessarily be so much more formidable.

They have huge innate bonuses and apts. that make you need a major XP investment to take full advantage. This includes the UC and Fighting. +5! HP and a +2 Fighting or even +0 Fighting would lead to training fighting to maximize the HP advantage being a no-brainer. Same with UC. The UC apt. is low to encourage weapon choice, instead of playing like a troll. Both of those are more mechanics than flavor though, I admit. Again though '-2 is their "average" apt. like Mummies If it's above -2 they are particularly good at it; if it's below, they are bad at it.

Also why don't they have natural Reach? (I know the mechanism of this sucks but hey that is a separate issues.)

Interesting idea...but effectively that's just...make everything work like Polearms, since Polearms have innate reach.

In particular I'd expect non-negative aptitudes for Longblades, Axes and M&F and Polearms as well as Throwing. Id also expect them to be good at Armor or at least not super bad at it.

From a flavour perspective...why are Demigods bad at everything? ...I didn't place the apts. from a flavour perspective I placed them so playing to the races STR advantage would take significant investment. Bloax and I discussed this on IRC for a bit before I posted.

[tasonir]

Being exceptionally bad at the start isn't a good thing. Being exceptionally strong in the late game isn't a good thing either. The late game is already the easier part on a standard race, taking this part and making it even easier is undesirable.

This race makes me want to struggle to level 15-20ish and then go to the abyss and scum until I've overcome the hugely negative apts, and then never be challenged ever again on my way to the orb. The only other race that makes me feel this way is mummies, who are well known for both being extremely weak and being used for scumming (not that scumming is optimal per say, it's just something that seems to be common with mummies).

[TehDruid]

They should remove vanilla Ogres and have the species option "Giant" which is then subdivided into: Ogre-Magi, Troll, Cyclops, Fire Giant, Frost Giant and Titan.

[Patashu]

They should remove vanilla Ogres and have the species option "Giant" which is then subdivided into: Ogre-Magi, Troll, Cyclops, Fire Giant, Frost Giant and Titan.

And Ettin and Two-Headed Ogre and Erolcha

[bcadren]

I thought about what people said and improved the apts; except XP, which is now lower than Demigods. The race grows slowly and can't dodge but has slaying bonuses and titan strength. Apts are a lot closer to average than other large races, because they aren't 'big and dumb' just gigantic. Also...renamed to titan.