duvessa wrote:dpeg wrote:duvessa wrote:his point is that trample is bad for players so it is pointless to give it to them
This is wrong. It is often, but clearly not always, bad to trample as a player. We could quibble whether optional trampling would be used in 10% or 1% or 0.1% of cases, but having the option will be useful at times (compare with cleaving on axes).
The point about the interface is that players will simply forget the tactical option if it used so rarely (it's a given that tramping should not be automatic).
the only application of trample is to move at your attack delay instead of your move delay, and for that to be useful you need an adjacent monster in the direction you wanted to move, which is generally a bad thing, and you risk just missing or killing that monster. the situations where trampling is actually beneficial are so contrived as to be essentially nonexistent in practice, barring a series of staggeringly bad decisions by the player (like taking chei and then trying to zotwaltz or something), so i am very comfortable saying it is always bad to trample as a player, even though it is easy to
imagine cases where it is good
I can pretty easily imagine some cases, it's easy to imagine them because they are relatively common in the game. Such as: I am fighting in a corridor, 1 enemy shows up behind me. If I use a trampling attack on that enemy, I can kill him while pushing down the corridor, while the enemies on the other side can't hit me (because I moved). Or maybe I'm running from something down a corridor, and there's an enemy blocking me! Oh no, if only I could push them somehow...
With that in mind, there's any number of situations where hitting a monster AND moving in the same turn would be much better than not moving. Such as, pushing a monster off the stairs, and pushing myself onto it, pushing a monster into a hallway to allow myself entry into that hallway, etc. Or even if I'm surrounded by monsters, if I keep trample attacking, I end up after a couple turns with just the trampled monster able to hit me, the rest can only try to follow.
If anything, it seems a little too useful.
I think crate has effectively spelled out why damaging knockback melee attacks would be highly problematic.