Tactical Input Syndrome

[dynast]

Its a mental disease that affects the player who comes to the realisation that pressing keys in a game is annoying.

In other words, i read too many GDD topics again.

[tabstorm]

What if I told you that there's a "traditional roguelike mechanic" in the game that could be removed without making Crawl's design appreciably worse, that is responsible for somewhere around 300-1000 extra keypresses per winning game, all of which have little to no impact whatsoever on the core gameplay?

[Croases]

I'd just like to say that Crawl's food clock led to some of the most fun experiences I've ever had in the game, because I use permafood very liberally and sometimes run out and have to dive to levels far above my head just to keep killing edible things.

The correct solution to the food dilemma is to generate less of it, not removing it altogether.

[Laraso]

Spell and ability hunger is the only aspect of the hunger system that I actually find interesting.

[byrel]

What if I told you that there's a "traditional roguelike mechanic" in the game that could be removed without making Crawl's design appreciably worse, that is responsible for somewhere around 300-1000 extra keypresses per winning game, all of which have little to no impact whatsoever on the core gameplay?

Would that be kobolds?

[tasonir]

I've always been somewhat fond of the spriggan food system, to be honest. No chunks, only half the permafood, being slow to clear levels doesn't matter much (low passive hunger), but spell/ability hunger costs still matter strongly. I've seen several other players run into trouble with food on spriggans and I've gotten low myself, although if you avoid too much spell hunger, you can generally always find enough food.

As a plus, it also would be something of a nerf to the regen spell, which is powerful enough to take the hit. Spamming regen constantly on spriggans can hurt you in the long run, but you have enough to use it when you need it.

[dynast]

I almost ran out of food on my spriggan run, but that is only because i was zapping my rod since the start of the run, learned spells like haste and statue form which i casted all the time and was trying to get a good turn count which prevented me from scumming abyss/pan for more food.
But yeah, spriggan foodclock might be a good improvement over current hunger but we all know mummy is the definitive solution.

[archaeo]

I'd just like to say that Crawl's food clock led to some of the most fun experiences I've ever had in the game, because I use permafood very liberally and sometimes run out and have to dive to levels far above my head just to keep killing edible things.

This is a bit like saying "I purposefully don't play Spelunky levels until the ghost shows up, because I find it more exciting to be chased." If you want this particular gameplay style, Croases, I recommend getting into turncount speedruns.

Spell and ability hunger is the only aspect of the hunger system that I actually find interesting.

That's because the game is playing tricks on you, Laraso. It shows you a dramatically colored status light, and you forget to notice that a) most of the things around you are made out of food and b) you have literally tens of thousands of nutrition units in your inventory. Unless you do things like 'zerk against every hobgoblin or forget to train spellcasting higher than about 6, food is just a speedbump.

[Laraso]

No, I enjoy it because it's basically a second resource other than mana that I have to manage. Even though I have hundreds of rations, it's not exactly good to be spending 3 or 5 turns (however long they take) eating food in the middle of combat, even if you have mana you can't just spam your big spells all the time everywhere you go unless you train a huge amount of spellcasting, are a kobold/mummy, or have an amulet of gourmand. It's a bit more interesting with Sif, you need to strike a balance of casting powerful spells and saving hunger for channeling.

But someone's probably just going to respond to this saying "no, hunger is irrelevant, you have permafood just eat it".

[dynast]

Or you can just eat food before engaging.

[archaeo]

But someone's probably just going to respond to this saying "no, hunger is irrelevant, you have permafood just eat it".

Right, thanks for saving us the trouble.

More seriously, what's the point of having a "second resource" for all of these spells and abilities? Most of them have a perfectly good first resource (MP, piety, exh, slow, breath, etc.) that already does all the heavy lifting as far as limiting things goes. How is it interesting with Sif, exactly, since even if you channel a bunch to finish a fight, at the end of that fight, you're likely surrounded by piles of food?

I could keep going (and lord knows I have), but I think you get the gist.

[WingedEspeon]

Mabe because all my casters have been sprigans/elves/extended characters that have all the exp they want I always have enough spellcasting to make sure that I don't starve in the middle of fights. Spellcasting is already an important skill because it determines max MP which is important if you are casting a lot of spells and/or have guardian spirit. Past that one level in spellcasting is worth 1/4 of a spell level in all of the schools making it important if you are trying to get a lot of spells of different schools. Hunger is only an issue right in the middle of a fight where you don't want to waste precious turns eating. When the fight is over you have permafood and you probably also have chunks for what you just killed.