Speaking of horse shit...

[Aule]

  Code:

  8794 | D:8      | Reached XP level 10. HP: 49/88 MP: 8/18
...
 10309 | D:9      | Noticed a wizard
 10321 | D:9      | Cast into the Abyss (a wizard)

[Sandman25]

As you learned staying on level with wizard was a serios mistake.

[tedric]

oh for frack's sake, the things that people are willing to blame the game for instead of blaming themselves

this little farce is nothing compared to:

  Code:

The orc sorcerer shouts!
Cast which spell? (? or * to list)
Aiming: Iskenderun's Mystic Blast
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f - orc sorcerer
Aim: an orc sorcerer, wielding a dagger and wearing a robe
The orb of energy hits the orc sorcerer.
The orc sorcerer is severely wounded.
The orb of energy explodes!
The orc sorcerer points at you and mumbles some strange words.
You suddenly lose the ability to move!
The orc sorcerer casts a spell.
The orc sorcerer gestures wildly while chanting.
The sun demon hits you! You are engulfed in flames!
The soul eater draws from the surrounding life force!
* * * LOW HITPOINT WARNING * * *
The sun demon hits you!!
* * * LOW HITPOINT WARNING * * *
You are engulfed in flames!
You die...

i had literally one chance for an action, and because IMB failed to one-shot it, i died

oh btw this was after easily two-shotting several other orc sorcerers with the same spell

but do i blame the game? no because i didn't bother to xv, and if i had i would have been like "oh i guess i should break LOS and/or put on this stasis amulet i've been carrying around since D6"

in summary: i'm calling bullshit on your horse shit

[Aule]

You just hold on right there, busterama... You're saying that encountering a Vaults-level monster that can Abyss you on D:10 even before either entrance to either orc or lair had been found is perfectly ordinary and no reason for complaint? I call cat shit on your bullshit to my horse shit, because that's just a bunch of shit.

So there.

@Sandman, what you're saying is not really helpful, because he was encountered face-to-face a dozen steps deep into a room with only one way out, back the opposite direction, so the wizard could have just as easily Abyssed my character in flight as he did facing off. I don't really see how the putative ability to run away makes this a fair monster placement in any way, shape or form.

[dynast]

http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Dynas ... 035011.txt
10794 | D:10 | Noticed a wizard

http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Dynast/morg ... 200100.txt
8635 | D:9 | Noticed a wizard

[Siegurt]

You just hold on right there, busterama... You're saying that encountering a Vaults-level monster that can Abyss you on D:10 even before either entrance to either orc or lair had been found is perfectly ordinary and no reason for complaint? I call cat shit on your bullshit to my horse shit, because that's just a bunch of shit.

So there.

@Sandman, what you're saying is not really helpful, because he was encountered face-to-face a dozen steps deep into a room with only one way out, back the opposite direction, so the wizard could have just as easily Abyssed my character in flight as he did facing off. I don't really see how the putative ability to run away makes this a fair monster placement in any way, shape or form.

Unless he was hasted, if you encountered him at the edge of you los, you could back up and he wouldn't have the chance, if you walked around a corner and he was there, you could walk back around said corner to put him back it out of los, although it is possible depending on the situation that he would be able to follow and get you in los where you wouldn't have a retreatable-to square out of los on your next move (although it would give you at least one more turn to like blink away or something)

Not to say I would've been that paranoid, but you could have been.

[tedric]

i was saying that it's not particularly horseshitty, and that you had 12 turns to do something about it

[Sandman25]

Am I the only one who uses scroll of blinking at full HP just to get out of LoS of Erolcha or wizard sometimes?

[Sandman25]

but do i blame the game? no because i didn't bother to xv, and if i had i would have been like "oh i guess i should break LOS and/or put on this stasis amulet i've been carrying around since D6"

Well, orc sorcerer is always threat number 1 for me in Orc, I don't think much about rF+, rC+, rPois or AC/EV, I think only about paralysis there.

[xentronium]

Well, getting abyssed is better than dying..wizards can 2 shot you from 88 hp if you get unucky.

[Aule]

Bright side: encountering wizards early isn't boring or tedious.

Maybe throw some titans and draconians up there, too. Mua-hah-hah...

[Sprucery]

Am I the only one who uses scroll of blinking at full HP just to get out of LoS of Erolcha or wizard sometimes?

I definitely do that if xv says that the chance of paralysis or banishment is more than I like.

What's hard is when you don't have a scroll of blinking...

I have to admit I only started respecting wizards after getting lightning-bolted to death by one...

[duvessa]

a wizard on d:10 is perfectly ordinary and no reason for complaint

[Sandman25]

Speaking of orc sorcerers. My current character (DrSu) has cleared Lair and main dungeon up to floor 11 inclusive and is about to enter Orc. When I use ?/m to check orc sorcerer it has 48% chance to paralyze me. Fortunately I found a bad quarterstaff with MR+ and I am going to use it despite having weapons of protection/evasion because it reduces the chance to "only" 16%.

[Aule]

a wizard on d:10 is perfectly ordinary and no reason for complaint

Well, I've only played fewer than 500 games, but I don't ever remember seeing one this early. So, no, not perfectly ordinary. Perfectly acceptable and, yes, no reason for complaint, but certainly a rarity.

[Blobbo]

Do centaurs poop horse shit, or people shit?

[Aule]

There was this scam going around town a few years back. There was talk about centaur shit being a miracle drug, and it was being peddled everywhere for just about everything, from acne to hair loss to ED. No regulation meant that anyone could promote it for whatever they wanted to, and it was completely out of control. Telemarketing scammers started cold calling cell phones and nursing homes, double-charging credit cards, and other malfeasances, so that got some people angry and demands for controls were high. Some particularly unscrupulous pushers were pretty clever in that they sponsored research papers ostensibly about experiments for improved cancer side-effect remedies that utilized it, lending an air of credence to the whole sham, but eventually the market collapsed after everyone had been wrung dry and it was clear the products were worthless. So many people were bamboozled, so much money was grifted, and it was just so stupid, because everyone should have known in the first place that centaurs don't shit. They burn everything, and waste nothing, and that's why they're so fast.

[ajon]

Please tell me that my sprigging shit I take to stimulate my ... uh hair growth, is not a sham too.

[Aule]

Wow... I decided to check what the earliest I'd seen one of these wizards might have been. I've actually encountered them three times early enough to have been logged, and the first time was this, one of my earliest games, in 2014:

  Code:

     0 | D:1      | Aule, the Deep Elf Wizard, began the quest for the Orb.
...
  3445 | D:3      | Reached XP level 5. HP: 16/28 MP: 8/19
...
  3700 | D:3      | Found a bloodstained altar of Trog.
  3700 | D:3      | Noticed a wizard
  3725 | D:3      | Killed a wizard

That's hilarious.

I formally and unequivocally retract my earlier complaint.

[Sandman25]

Is it a vault where wizard is trapped and cannot move?

[Sar]

Yeah, that wizard is not actually a "wizard" wizard IIRC.

[Aule]

Come on... Do you really want me to equivocate about retracting my unequivocal retraction?

I wouldn't have been able to kill him if he were trapped, not at XL5.

Are there really two monsters named wizard?

[gammafunk]

Yeah, that wizard is not actually a "wizard" wizard IIRC.

That wizard came from the moon.

[Sandman25]

Come on... Do you really want me to equivocate about retracting my unequivocal retraction?

I wouldn't have been able to kill him if he were trapped, not at XL5.

Are there really two monsters named wizard?

How much XP did you get for it?

[Aule]

Here's the morgue file: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Aule/morgue-Aule-20141028-205520.txt

No way to see the XP gained by killing it, I think.

That wizard came from the moon.

Which one?

I hope it's Europa. I like Europa. Just as long as it's not Phobos.

[Sandman25]

Here's the morgue file: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Aule/morgue-Aule-20141028-205520.txt

No way to see the XP gained by killing it, I think.

I am sure it was not standard wizard who gives 658 XP because you have not reached next XL (6) which requires 130 XP.

Edit. http://crawl.chaosforge.org/Xp
http://crawl.chaosforge.org/Wizard_(monster)

[Aule]

So that means there are indeed two "wizards." Now we're back to horse shit again, dammit.

Maybe this unnamed moon can shed some light.

[gammafunk]

It is a wizard, just one that's permanently mute and has no spells:

  Code:

KMONS:  1 = wizard perm_ench:mute spells:. dbname:captured_wizard ; nothing


should be worth about 576 XP if you can kill it, since not having spells reduces it XP value.

[Lasty]

Do log notes record the deaths of monsters you don't cause? You don't get any XP for the vault killing the trapped wizard, but for all I know it might end up in your log anyway.

[Aule]

Oh yeah! Now I remember (vaguely). It's a vault with a wizard that Trog executes before your eyes. It took 25 turns probably because maybe I ran and then tippy-toed back to see. I'm sure the vault doesn't take that long to accomplish it.

Thanks for clearing that one up, guys. The stable looks good, now. Smells fresh, too.