YASD - GrEE Dies in Tornado-Casting Mishap

[zdzichorowerzysta]

This is EXACTLY same place where I died last time - https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=21760&p=294056#p294056

I've dumped character dump on pastebin - http://pastebin.com/raw/U6u5jX4i

[Sprucery]

Sorry for your loss. If you were trying to get Necromutation online, why were you training only necromancy and not transmutations at all? Was a +0 robe really the best thing to wear?

[VeryAngryFelid]

Level 25+ skills are very expensive and don't do much, train more Fighting next time, 172 HP is too low. MDA would give you much higher AC (about 50 with some Armour skill) and wouldn't hurt your spells much with your Str and wizardry. Also +2 robe of archmagi would give you more spell power and AC than that robe.

[zdzichorowerzysta]

This robe was giving me +6 int, but that is right I should try diffrent robe

[Nebukadnezar]

You died while having only F+++ and rcorr in addition to what your char started with.
Not even C+ while facing an Ice Fiend.
Only N+ while facing several tormentors.
A garg has such an easy time to get max resists.

Against 1 or 2 tormentors + popcorn it will work.
Against anything else you rely on bad monster behaviour (like: moving towards you).
The monsters on the screen aren't popcorn and the spells you have will leave them several turns to cast/attack while they take damage.

Skilling:
Spellcasting to 25: this is very expensive.
air+earth: 27 is very very expensive. I guess you wanted to get the max power from your main spells but as soon as you hit 2% (or whatever) stop skilling that and skill something else.

Positioning/Fighting:
Your spells are loud. Very loud.
They will attract more monster.
It is ok if you are in an area where they are in limited amount.
Hell #7 is not such a place.
Retreat after you cast shatter several times. Especially since every monster can move now freely (no walls) towards you.
Tornado is a spell for chars with more staying power than yours. Nice as a panic button but it really shines when you can stay in the middle of a crowd. Get the resists (C+, N+++) and as much fighting/dodging as possible when you want to use it.


Items:
Again I guess you wanted to max out Int to get more power from your spells but look at them:
you have 2 items with sinv. Both also give relec which you already have.
This means you're running around with F+, Int 4, MP+9, sinv from 2 artifact items.
F+ you don't even need in Dis (with F++). Is it really worth for Int 4, MP+9, Sinv to use up 2 item slots ?
I don't think so when I look at what you were missing imo.
(I don't even think there are invisible monster in Dis.)
robe: already said.

And finally:
You had CBLink at 1%.
Use it
You can even chain-use it to get back to the exit.
There is no reason fo this char to get into that situation.
This char may have looked invincible (and pleasing for the player) for a long period but it is not.

[VeryAngryFelid]

I agree with everything except Tornado. Any character can use Tornado (even Felid without Transmutations, it takes 1 turn to cast and then you can do whatever you would do even without Tornado). 54 AC+EV total is totally fine and more importantly it had Makhleb.

[Nebukadnezar]

I agree with everything except Tornado. Any character can use Tornado (even Felid without Transmutations, it takes 1 turn to cast and then you can do whatever you would do even without Tornado). 54 AC+EV total is totally fine and more importantly it had Makhleb.

ok, then let me clarify it:
yes, every char can use it.
It is imo even the perferct spell when there are monster close to you especially when your other spells are for example firestorm and OOD.
But it is a lousy spell for killing fast and a lousy spell when the threats you face are
- at the edge of LOS
- capable of killing you from at distance (Hellfire, Torment)
- able to reposition you like iron giants. It is hard to get them that close to you that Tornado does damage while staying away from them to avoid being thrown around.

and more and more monsters of the same type are arriving at the edge of LOS where Tornado is the weakest.
Tornado won't solve any problems like that.
Shatter won't solve them, too.

I guess this char had great fun to laugh at every threat for some time but this isn't place to laugh at threats especially when Tornado does next to nothing and shatter opens more ways for monster to come and this combined in Hell #7 is like asking for big big trouble which is totally to be expected.

Don't get me wrong: Tornado is my favourite spell right after CBlink.
I guess your felid wouldn't have stayed in that position for a peiod of time knowing that more and more come looking.
That's what I meant with: get more staying power if you want to stay in a position like that

[tabstorm]

Tornado and shatter are underwhelming in extended. Shatter is resisted by a few key (read: tormenting) enemies, and tornado takes too long to kill the same enemies. OTOH you chose to use Makhleb, so you probably didn't have access to firestorm, glaciate, chain lightning, OOD, and so on. Since you had controlled blink, you could have just blinked out of that situation twice and then fled upstairs. There is easily a full HP bar of damage onscreen for you right now, so that was not a location in which you should have taken risks with tornado.

[VeryAngryFelid]

That's what I meant with: get more staying power if you want to stay in a position like that

Ok, let me clarify then. Do you mean the character had less defense than Troll in Statue Form vs ice fiend, briemstone fiend and iron giant? Yes, absolutely. Do you mean it had worse defense than minotaur in CPA and alike? I don't think so. Tornado is slow in extended indeed but I don't think there is a single spell that makes it comfortable to kill those monsters, I had problems in the same vault despite having fire storm AND necromutation. There are just too many monsters and they have both torment and dispel undead so it requires very careful tactics (and some luck also).

Edit. I read tabstorm's reply above this message after posting it and this is my thinking also.

[Nebukadnezar]

Yes, let's make it short: Tabstorm's reply is my thinking also