YAVP : OpTm^Chei, just awesome


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Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 13:18

YAVP : OpTm^Chei, just awesome

Going UC, I'll ultimately want Staue Form as Chei already slows me.

Just found this in an Abyss trip
  Code:
 l - the +8 large shield of the Jabberwock {Int+1 Slay+6}

Is it worth to train some shield, or not ?

  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15.1-1-gfacfea3 (webtiles) character file.

mopl the Black Belt (Octopode Transmuter)          Turns: 32039, Time: 02:06:15

HP 110/110       AC  5     Str 20      XL: 16   Next: 78%
MP  39/39        EV 26     Int 29      God: Cheibriados [*****.]
Gold 1249        SH  0     Dex 28      Spells:  5 memorised,  8 levels left

rFire  + . .     SeeInvis +       - Unarmed
rCold  + + +     Clarity  .     (no shield)
rNeg   + . .     rCorr    .     L - +2 hat
rPois  +         rRot     .     I - amulet "Chisel" {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
rElec  +         Spirit   .     t - ring "Bruhung" {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
SustAb .         Warding  .     z - ring of protection from cold
rMut   .         Stasis   +     d - +2 ring of protection
Gourm  .                        B - ring of regeneration
MR     ++...                    V - ring of stealth
                                c - ring of see invisible
                                p - ring of poison resistance
                                h - ring of regeneration

@: very slow, very resistant to hostile enchantments, incredibly stealthy
A: almost no armour, amphibious, 8 rings, constrict 8, camouflage 1, magic
resistance 1, sense surroundings 1, gelatinous body 1
a: Bend Time, Temporal Distortion, Slouch, Step From Time, Renounce Religion,
Evoke Invisibility


You are on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts.
You worship Cheibriados.
Cheibriados is extremely pleased with you.
You are full.

You have visited 4 branches of the dungeon, and seen 28 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 2 times.
You have also visited: Volcano.

You have collected 3035 gold pieces.
You have spent 1786 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 b - a +0 blowgun
Missiles
 e - 93 poisoned needles
 f - 2 tomahawks (quivered)
 n - 13 curare-tipped needles
 s - 2 needles of paralysis
 W - 256 arrows
 Z - 2 throwing nets
Armour
 l - the +8 large shield of the Jabberwock {Int+1 Slay+6}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Abyss)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+1).
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+6).
 L - a +2 hat (worn)
Magical devices
 k - a wand of disintegration {zapped: 1}
 q - a wand of lightning
 w - a wand of teleportation (3)
 C - a wand of invisibility (4)
 E - a wand of polymorph {zapped: 1}
 F - a wand of confusion {zapped: 5}
 G - a wand of cold {zapped: 4}
 H - a wand of confusion
 K - a wand of cold {zapped: 3}
 M - a wand of fireball {zapped: 1}
Comestibles
 a - 12 bread rations
Scrolls
 i - 6 scrolls of identify
 j - 5 scrolls of fog
 o - 14 scrolls of remove curse
 r - a scroll of vulnerability
 u - a scroll of fear
 v - a scroll of enchant weapon
 y - 5 scrolls of teleportation
 O - a scroll of magic mapping
 Q - 3 scrolls of blinking
 R - a scroll of summoning
 U - 4 scrolls of immolation
Jewellery
 c - a ring of see invisible (on tentacle)
 d - a +2 ring of protection (on tentacle)
 h - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 p - a ring of poison resistance (on tentacle)
 t - the ring "Bruhung" (left tentacle) {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 3 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   [ring of magical power]
   
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It makes you more stealthy.
 z - a ring of protection from cold (right tentacle)
 B - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 I - the amulet "Chisel" (around mantle) {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
   (You found it on level 6 of the Dungeon)   
   
   [amulet of stasis]
   
   It prevents you from being teleported, slowed, hasted or paralysed.
   It protects you from fire.
   It greatly protects you from cold.
   It protects you from negative energy.
 V - a ring of stealth (on tentacle)
 X - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
Potions
 m - 2 potions of heal wounds
 x - 3 potions of might
 A - a potion of cancellation
 J - 11 potions of curing
 N - 3 potions of resistance
 P - 6 potions of agility
 T - 3 potions of invisibility
 Y - a potion of brilliance
Miscellaneous
 g - a plain deck of defence {drawn: 2}
 D - a plain deck of cards {drawn: 1}
 S - a plain deck of summonings {drawn: 2}


   Skills:
 + Level 10.4 Fighting
 + Level 11.9 Dodging
 - Level 10.0 Stealth
 + Level 16.5 Unarmed Combat
 - Level 5.0 Spellcasting
 - Level 5.0 Charms
 - Level 8.0 Transmutations
 - Level 3.0 Ice Magic
 - Level 5.6 Poison Magic
 - Level 11.0 Invocations
 - Level 10.5 Evocations


You have 8 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
b - Spider Form           Trmt/Pois      #####.....   1%          3    #......
c - Ice Form              Ice/Trmt       #####...     10%         4    ###....
d - Blade Hands           Trmt           ######....   10%         5    #####..
s - Ozocubu's Armour      Chrm/Ice       ####....     4%          3    #......
W - Sticks to Snakes      Trmt           ######....   1%          2    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:5             Orc (4/4) D:10
    Elf (0/3) Orc:4          Lair (8/8) D:8           Swamp (0/5) Lair:6
  Snake (0/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:6       Vaults (0/5) D:13
 Depths (0/5) D:15       

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh

Shops:
D:5 (   D:14 (   Orc:3 =   Orc:4 [[(!?


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You cannot wear most types of armour.
You are amphibious.
You can wear up to eight rings at the same time.
You can use your tentacles to constrict many enemies at once.
Your skin changes colour to match your surroundings (Stealth).
Your rubbery body absorbs attacks (AC +1).
You are resistant to hostile enchantments.
You passively map a small area around you.


Message History

There is an open door here.
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
You climb upwards.
There is a stone staircase leading down here.
You see here 16 stones.
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
You climb upwards.
There is a stone staircase leading down here.
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
You climb upwards.
There is a stone staircase leading down here.
You see here a runed whip.
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
You climb upwards.
There is a stone staircase leading down here.
There is a staircase to the Lair here.
You climb downwards. Welcome to the Lair of Beasts!
There is a staircase back to the Dungeon here.
Unknown command.
Unknown command.

...........................#
...###.#.#..##.####P...###.#
...........................#
#.###.##...#..#.#.##.#.###.#
...........................#
##.#.#.#.##...#..#.#.#.###.#
...........................#
.%...##P..P###.###/#.......#
.%.............:@!((.).....#
#.#.#.######.#.#%?|#####.#.#
..##########.#.###"###P###.#
....###...........[........#
#.......#P##........######.#
.##.#...###P........###.##.##
....##..#...................#
.⌠...#..#......####..P####.##
........+.....######.#####.#


There are no monsters in sight!
Last edited by mopl on Monday, 22nd September 2014, 14:50, edited 1 time in total.
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 11111

Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 13:28

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

I wouldn't train Shields here. There is no way to remove shield-related attack speed penalty for UC and as Op of Chei you already can deal exteremely high damage even without rings of slaying, especially in Statue Form.
I ama not sure how being with Chei encourages Statue Form, I think it discourages it as your damage is already increased and you don't want to be unstealthy and let monsters shoot at you 3 turns while you are moving.
User avatar

Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:02

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Sandman25 wrote:I wouldn't train Shields here. There is no way to remove shield-related attack speed penalty for UC and as Op of Chei you already can deal exteremely high damage even without rings of slaying, especially in Statue Form.
I ama not sure how being with Chei encourages Statue Form, I think it discourages it as your damage is already increased and you don't want to be unstealthy and let monsters shoot at you 3 turns while you are moving.

Statue Form decreases Stealth ? I didn't know that

Sequell wrote:statue form[1/5]: Grants great AC (17 + earth/2), a 30% HP boost, and +2 Str, but makes the base cost of an action 15 instead of 10, similar to the slow spell, and reduces dex by 2 (was EV by 10 in 0.14-). Melds gloves, boots/barding, and body armour. Provides rPois, rElec, rN+, and rRot+. 3+str/3 bonus unarmed damage, and 50% damage bonus to all melee. {Stoneskin} also gives more AC.

But what really encourages me to use Statue Form is mainly being a fragile Op... You don't want to wander around with 5 AC...

Crawl was kind to give me a book of Transfigurations, I will continue and use Ozo armour, and swap for Stoneskin when Statue Form is available...

What about Dragon Form ?

Edit : I also found a book of Battle. Is Shroud of Golubria still useful ? What about regeneration with 2 regen rings ?

  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15.1-1-gfacfea3 (webtiles) character file.

mopl the Black Belt (Octopode Transmuter)          Turns: 39612, Time: 02:44:55

HP 126/126       AC  5     Str 24      XL: 18   Next: 68%
MP  42/42        EV 28     Int 33      God: Cheibriados [******]
Gold 1903        SH  0     Dex 33      Spells:  6 memorised,  6 levels left

rFire  + . .     SeeInvis +       - Unarmed
rCold  + + +     Clarity  .     (no shield)
rNeg   + . .     rCorr    .     L - +2 hat
rPois  +         rRot     .     I - amulet "Chisel" {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
rElec  +         Spirit   .     c - ring of see invisible
SustAb .         Warding  .     z - ring of protection from cold
rMut   .         Stasis   +     d - +2 ring of protection
Gourm  .                        B - ring of regeneration
MR     ++...                    V - ring of stealth
                                t - ring "Bruhung" {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
                                p - ring of poison resistance
                                h - ring of regeneration

@: very slow, very resistant to hostile enchantments, incredibly stealthy
A: almost no armour, amphibious, 8 rings, constrict 8, camouflage 1, magic
resistance 1, sense surroundings 1, gelatinous body 1
a: Bend Time, Temporal Distortion, Slouch, Step From Time, Renounce Religion,
Evoke Invisibility


You are on level 5 of the Snake Pit.
You worship Cheibriados.
Cheibriados is exalted by your worship.
You are not hungry.

You have visited 6 branches of the dungeon, and seen 38 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 2 times.
You have also visited: Volcano.

You have collected 3689 gold pieces.
You have spent 1786 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 b - a +0 blowgun
Missiles
 e - 99 poisoned needles
 n - 25 curare-tipped needles
 W - 256 arrows
 Z - 2 throwing nets (quivered)
Armour
 L - a +2 hat (worn)
Magical devices
 k - a wand of disintegration {zapped: 1}
 q - a wand of lightning
 r - a wand of cold {zapped: 4}
 w - a wand of teleportation (3)
 C - a wand of invisibility (4)
 E - a wand of polymorph {zapped: 1}
 F - a wand of confusion
 G - a wand of cold {zapped: 4}
 M - a wand of fireball {zapped: 1}
Comestibles
 a - 19 bread rations
 l - 3 rotting chunks of naga flesh
 s - a chunk of spriggan flesh
Scrolls
 i - 12 scrolls of identify
 j - 7 scrolls of fog
 o - 18 scrolls of remove curse
 v - a scroll of enchant armour
 y - 7 scrolls of teleportation
 K - a scroll of fear
 O - 3 scrolls of magic mapping
 Q - 4 scrolls of blinking
 R - a scroll of summoning
 U - 4 scrolls of immolation
Jewellery
 c - a ring of see invisible (left tentacle)
 d - a +2 ring of protection (on tentacle)
 h - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 p - a ring of poison resistance (on tentacle)
 t - the ring "Bruhung" (on tentacle) {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 3 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   [ring of magical power]
   
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It makes you more stealthy.
 z - a ring of protection from cold (right tentacle)
 B - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 I - the amulet "Chisel" (around mantle) {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
   (You found it on level 6 of the Dungeon)   
   
   [amulet of stasis]
   
   It prevents you from being teleported, slowed, hasted or paralysed.
   It protects you from fire.
   It greatly protects you from cold.
   It protects you from negative energy.
 V - a ring of stealth (on tentacle)
 X - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
Potions
 m - 2 potions of heal wounds
 x - 3 potions of might
 A - 2 potions of cancellation
 J - 12 potions of curing
 N - 3 potions of resistance
 P - 5 potions of agility
 T - 4 potions of invisibility
Books
 u - a book of Transfigurations   
   
   Spells                             Type                      Level
   Stoneskin                          Transmutation/Earth          2
   *Ice Form                          Ice/Transmutation            4
   Statue Form                        Transmutation/Earth          6
   Dragon Form                        Transmutation                7
Miscellaneous
 f - a phial of floods
 g - a plain deck of defence {drawn: 2}
 D - a plain deck of cards {drawn: 1}
 S - a plain deck of summonings {drawn: 2}


   Skills:
 - Level 12.0 Fighting
 - Level 12.1 Dodging
 + Level 11.2 Stealth
 + Level 18.6 Unarmed Combat
 - Level 6.0 Spellcasting
 - Level 5.0 Charms
 + Level 8.5 Transmutations
 - Level 3.0 Ice Magic
 - Level 5.0 Air Magic
 - Level 5.6 Poison Magic
 - Level 13.0 Invocations
 - Level 10.5 Evocations


You have 6 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
b - Spider Form           Trmt/Pois      ######....   1%          3    None
c - Ice Form              Ice/Trmt       #####...     4%          4    ##.....
d - Blade Hands           Trmt           ######....   3%          5    ####...
i - Deflect Missiles      Chrm/Air       #####.....   82%         6    ######.
s - Ozocubu's Armour      Chrm/Ice       #####...     2%          3    None
W - Sticks to Snakes      Trmt           ######....   1%          2    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:5             Orc (4/4) D:10
    Elf (0/3) Orc:4          Lair (8/8) D:8           Swamp (5/5) Lair:6
  Snake (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:6       Vaults (0/5) D:13
 Depths (0/5) D:15       

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh

Shops:
D:5 (   D:14 (   Orc:3 =   Orc:4 [[(!?

Annotations:
Swamp:5 Mara
Snake:4 exclusion: 2 naga sharpshooters, Vashnia
Snake:5 exclusion: Roxanne, Roxanne


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You cannot wear most types of armour.
You are amphibious.
You can wear up to eight rings at the same time.
You can use your tentacles to constrict many enemies at once.
Your skin changes colour to match your surroundings (Stealth).
Your rubbery body absorbs attacks (AC +1).
You are resistant to hostile enchantments.
You passively map a small area around you.


Message History

You start resting. You feel sick.
You feel sick.
Your transformation is almost over.
You feel sick.
You start resting.
You feel sick. x5
Your tentacles revert to their normal proportions.
You feel sick.
You start resting.
You feel sick. x10
You are no longer poisoned.
You start resting.
HP restored.
v - a scroll of enchant armour
Unknown command.
Unknown command.
Unknown command.
Unknown command.
Okay, then.
Unknown command.

#      ##.........##
        ##..#......###
         ##......S...#
          #............ ,  ,*
        ###..#####.8...   ,
      ###.....##  .....
     ##........## *...
    ##..........##  . ,      ,
   ##...........@#   ,
  ##............#.?...#
###...(.........#....##
#...................##
#.........%....#...##
...................#
..................##
.................##
...........##...##


There are no monsters in sight!
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 11111

Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:29

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

No, Statue Form does not decrease stealth, my mistake.

Edit. two regeneration rings stack ("Each ring of regeneration adds 40") http://crawl.chaosforge.org/Regeneration_rate

For this message the author Sandman25 has received thanks:
mopl
User avatar

Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:31

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

And what about Dragon Form, Shroud of Goubria and Regen ?
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125
User avatar

Pandemonium Purger

Posts: 1337

Joined: Saturday, 7th July 2012, 02:28

Location: Limbo

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:42

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

The shield is absolutely amazing and you should definitely use it, because nobody cares about the speed penalty. (What's more substantial is that your spell success is gonna take a big hit.)
Statue form is where it's at if you're an Op with good gear, especially now that you keep 100% of your EV; dragon form isn't really all that *great* in the first place. (Sure it hits hard, but survivability is more valueable when you can't run.)

In fact if you combine the huge shield with statue form you'll have great AC/EV/SH which is pretty hilarious for an Op, and especially so when you also hit like a truck. (might wanna get some more str for that sweet damage)
Last edited by Bloax on Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:44, edited 1 time in total.
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

Did you know that I like ruining crawl every now and then? Go check it out.

For this message the author Bloax has received thanks:
mopl

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 11111

Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:43

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

mopl wrote:And what about Dragon Form, Shroud of Goubria and Regen ?


I can tell you a story about them. Yesterday I realized I have never used Dragon Form so I started a DrMo despite having high temperature. I got white color (immunity to slow from cold!), I had Regeneration and Shoud of Golubria castable, there was a book with Dragon Form in Orc4 so everything looked great. But then I removed an exclusion from Aizul and died to it despite having 2 Makhleb summons because I forgot to cast those spells and quaff buffs (high temperature made me too lazy).
But yes, these spells are great :) (not sure about Dragon Form for Op though).

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 11111

Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:47

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Bloax wrote:In fact if you combine the huge shield with statue form you'll have great AC/EV/SH which is pretty hilarious for an Op, and especially so when you also hit like a truck. (might wanna get some more str for that sweet damage)


I believe high AC/EV make SH not that important and it will take huge XP to train Shields to 25.

Edit. Also shield is not that great for Chei because such characters have to fight multiple monsters more often than non-Chei characters.
User avatar

Pandemonium Purger

Posts: 1337

Joined: Saturday, 7th July 2012, 02:28

Location: Limbo

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:53

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

I have extensive Chei experience and I can tell you that shields are absolutely great because you will be fighting a ton of monsters, which means that high AC/EV won't serve as well as high AC/EV/SH.
and who said you can't do things with the penalty still in place :^)
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

Did you know that I like ruining crawl every now and then? Go check it out.

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 6394

Joined: Tuesday, 30th October 2012, 19:06

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 14:56

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Dragon form for an op is like Dragon form for anything, get huge damage and a good breath weapon in
Exchange for having generally poorer defenses and losing any benefits from melded equipment.

For op the defense loss is usually not as large, because op defenses are usually not that great. And you get to keep two rings unmelded, so how much of a detriment the melding is depends on how good the rest of your rings are.

Chei does help with dragon form, as part of that huge damage is from stats.

But you still can't kill more than one thing per attack, and chei is dangerous, dragon form is dangerous, stacking them together is often very risky.
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mopl

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 11111

Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 15:08

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Bloax wrote:I have extensive Chei experience and I can tell you that shields are absolutely great because you will be fighting a ton of monsters, which means that high AC/EV won't serve as well as high AC/EV/SH.
and who said you can't do things with the penalty still in place :^)


Of course extra defense is always useful. But without training Shields you can get a pretty big extra delay like 0.4-0.5 turns sometimes (attacking with 1.1-1.2 instead of 0.7, OP has UC 16) and it can allow to be double-attacked by most monsters.

You may be interested to look at
http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bl ... 000920.txt
The guy didn't use even normal shield of protection/reflection :)
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Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 15:18

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Extra attacks aren't all that bad when you have ~200 hp and 30 AC/EV/SH
Sandman25 wrote:You may be interested to look at
http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bl ... 000920.txt
The guy didn't use even normal shield of protection/reflection :)


That's because the entire build was focused extensively around blade hands (which merges shields) while also extraordinarily exp starved, back in the old days when I didn't go as fast shields were a huge help.
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

Did you know that I like ruining crawl every now and then? Go check it out.

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Joined: Tuesday, 24th September 2013, 17:52

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 15:43

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Bloax wrote:I have extensive Chei experience and I can tell you that shields are absolutely great because you will be fighting a ton of monsters, which means that high AC/EV won't serve as well as high AC/EV/SH.
and who said you can't do things with the penalty still in place :^)


I have a lot of Chei experience as well and I completely agree. People get down on shields a lot, but the difference in survivability with a shield vs no shield is substantial (even more so on a frail Octopode). That shield the OP found is fucking amazing and he should absolutely use it imo.
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Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 15:50

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Statue Form is now online, great defense improvement :D

I'll raise Str on the last levels, I think raising Dex at the beginning wasn't optimal...

The shield is great but kills my spell success, and being able to cast Statue Form is more important than SH + Slaying (imho). But I'll train Shields soon to use it asap

  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15.1-1-gfacfea3 (webtiles) character file.

mopl the Black Belt (Octopode Transmuter)          Turns: 52218, Time: 03:56:42

HP 189/189 (197) AC 39     Str 26      XL: 22   Next: 48%
MP  42/47        EV 30     Int 36      God: Cheibriados [******]
Gold 2842        SH  0     Dex 36      Spells:  8 memorised, 13 levels left

rFire  + . .     SeeInvis +       - Unarmed
rCold  + + +     Clarity  .     (no shield)
rNeg   + + +     rCorr    .     L - +2 hat
rPois  +         rRot     +     I - amulet "Chisel" {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
rElec  +         Spirit   .     c - ring of see invisible
SustAb .         Warding  .     z - ring of protection from cold
rMut   .         Stasis   +     d - +2 ring of protection
Gourm  .                        B - ring of regeneration
MR     +++..                    Y - ring of protection from magic
                                t - ring "Bruhung" {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
                                e - ring "Chughi" {rN+ Dex+3 Int+3}
                                h - ring of regeneration

@: statue-form, stone skin, deflect missiles, very slow, extremely resistant to
hostile enchantments, incredibly stealthy
A: almost no armour, amphibious, 8 rings, constrict 8, camouflage 1, magic
resistance 1, sense surroundings 1, (gelatinous body 0)
a: End Transformation, Bend Time, Temporal Distortion, Slouch, Step From Time,
Renounce Religion, Evoke Invisibility
}: 1/15 runes: serpentine


You are on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts.
You worship Cheibriados.
Cheibriados is exalted by your worship.
You are full.

You are a stone statue.

You have visited 8 branches of the dungeon, and seen 44 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 2 times.
You have also visited: Volcano and Wizlab.

You have collected 5375 gold pieces.
You have spent 2533 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 b - a +0 blowgun
Missiles
 n - 25 curare-tipped needles
 W - 296 arrows
 Z - 2 throwing nets (quivered)
Armour
 p - a buckler
 L - a +2 hat (worn)
Magical devices
 k - a wand of disintegration (7)
 l - a wand of digging (13)
 q - a wand of lightning
 r - a wand of cold {zapped: 4}
 w - a wand of teleportation (3)
 C - a wand of invisibility (4)
 G - a wand of cold {zapped: 4}
 H - a wand of disintegration
 M - a wand of fireball {zapped: 2}
Comestibles
 a - 19 bread rations
Scrolls
 i - 19 scrolls of identify
 j - 8 scrolls of fog
 o - 22 scrolls of remove curse
 v - a scroll of torment
 y - 10 scrolls of teleportation
 K - 3 scrolls of fear
 O - 3 scrolls of magic mapping
 Q - 5 scrolls of blinking
 R - 2 scrolls of summoning
 U - 5 scrolls of immolation
Jewellery
 c - a ring of see invisible (left tentacle)
 d - a +2 ring of protection (on tentacle)
 e - the ring "Chughi" (on tentacle) {rN+ Dex+3 Int+3}
   (You took it off an unborn on level 3 of the Crypt)   
   
   [ring of positive energy]
   
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
   It affects your dexterity (+3).
   It protects you from negative energy.
 h - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 t - the ring "Bruhung" (on tentacle) {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 3 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   [ring of magical power]
   
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It makes you more stealthy.
 u - an uncursed ring of protection from fire
 z - a ring of protection from cold (right tentacle)
 B - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 I - the amulet "Chisel" (around mantle) {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
   (You found it on level 6 of the Dungeon)   
   
   [amulet of stasis]
   
   It prevents you from being teleported, slowed, hasted or paralysed.
   It protects you from fire.
   It greatly protects you from cold.
   It protects you from negative energy.
 X - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
 Y - a ring of protection from magic (on tentacle)
Potions
 m - a potion of heal wounds
 x - 6 potions of might
 A - 3 potions of cancellation
 J - 9 potions of curing
 N - 3 potions of resistance
 P - 5 potions of agility
 T - 4 potions of invisibility
Miscellaneous
 f - a phial of floods
 g - a plain deck of defence {drawn: 2}
 S - a plain deck of summonings {drawn: 2}


   Skills:
 - Level 13.0 Fighting
 - Level 13.0 Dodging
 - Level 15.0 Stealth
 + Level 19.0 Unarmed Combat
 - Level 11.3 Spellcasting
 - Level 10.0 Charms
 - Level 3.0 Necromancy
 - Level 11.0 Transmutations
 - Level 3.0 Ice Magic
 - Level 10.0 Air Magic
 - Level 11.0 Earth Magic
 - Level 5.6 Poison Magic
 - Level 13.0 Invocations
 - Level 10.5 Evocations


You have 13 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Ozocubu's Armour      Chrm/Ice       ######..     1%          3    None
b - Statue Form           Trmt/Erth      #######..    4%          6    ####...
d - Blade Hands           Trmt           #######...   1%          5    None
i - Deflect Missiles      Chrm/Air       #######...   8%          6    ####...
r - Regeneration          Chrm/Necr      ######....   1%          3    None
s - Stoneskin             Trmt/Erth      #######.     1%          2    None
A - Spider Form           Trmt/Pois      ######....   1%          3    None
W - Sticks to Snakes      Trmt           #######...   1%          2    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:5             Orc (4/4) D:10
    Elf (0/3) Orc:4          Lair (8/8) D:8           Swamp (5/5) Lair:6
  Snake (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:6       Vaults (3/5) D:13
  Crypt (3/3) Vaults:3       Tomb (0/3) Crypt:3      Depths (0/5) D:15

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh

Shops:
D:5 (   D:14 (   Orc:3 =   Orc:4 [[(!?   Vaults:1 *   Vaults:2 *

Annotations:
Swamp:5 Mara
Snake:4 exclusion: 2 naga sharpshooters, Vashnia


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You cannot wear most types of armour.
You are amphibious.
You can wear up to eight rings at the same time.
You can use your tentacles to constrict many enemies at once.
Your skin changes colour to match your surroundings (Stealth).
((Your rubbery body absorbs attacks (AC +1).))
You are resistant to hostile enchantments.
You passively map a small area around you.


Message History

Unknown command.
Unknown command.
Saving game... please wait.
Welcome back, mopl the Octopode Transmuter.
Cheibriados says: Take it easy.
Press ? for a list of commands and other information.
Char dumped successfully.
Saving game... please wait.
Welcome back, mopl the Octopode Transmuter.
Cheibriados says: Take it easy.
Press ? for a list of commands and other information.
Adjust (i)tems, (s)pells, or (a)bilities?
Adjust which spell?
a - Stoneskin
Adjust to which letter?
s - Stoneskin; a - Ozocubu's Armour
Cast which spell? (? or * to list)
Your stone body feels more resilient.
Char dumped successfully.
Saving game... please wait.

###.##...#..#.#.##.#.###.#
.........................#
.#.#.#.##...#..#.#.#.###.#
.........................#
...##P..P###.###/#.......#
............::<!((().....#
#.#.######.#.#%?|#####.#.#
##########.#.###=###P###.#
..###...........8........#
......#P##........######.#
#.#...###P........###.##.##
..##..#...................#
...#..#......####..P####.##
......+.....######.#####.#
.........................#
...........##.###.#.#.##.#
......#..................#


There are no monsters in sight!
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125
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Posts: 1337

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Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 15:53

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

You should probably train dodging/shields instead of unarmed.
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

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mopl

Abyss Ambulator

Posts: 1205

Joined: Friday, 8th November 2013, 17:02

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 16:48

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Don't OPs not suffer any UC delay penalty for shields? I could have sworn I saw that somewhat recently in a code snippet someone put up on the tavern.
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Location: Limbo

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 17:01

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

They still suffer shield penalties.
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

Did you know that I like ruining crawl every now and then? Go check it out.
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Shoals Surfer

Posts: 287

Joined: Tuesday, 11th June 2013, 01:29

Location: NJ, USA

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 19:18

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

skjarl wrote:
Bloax wrote:I have extensive Chei experience and I can tell you that shields are absolutely great because you will be fighting a ton of monsters, which means that high AC/EV won't serve as well as high AC/EV/SH.
and who said you can't do things with the penalty still in place :^)


I have a lot of Chei experience as well and I completely agree. People get down on shields a lot, but the difference in survivability with a shield vs no shield is substantial (even more so on a frail Octopode). That shield the OP found is fucking amazing and he should absolutely use it imo.

Part of the shield hate is just legacy of the recent old versions where shields weren't that good. A point in SH is still not quite as good as AC or EV, but shield reform has made shields much better.
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Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 20:08

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Bloax wrote:They still suffer shield penalties.


Oh, the special OP bonus is that they still get their offhand attack with a shield. I suppose that makes sense.

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mopl

Sar

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Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 6418

Joined: Friday, 6th July 2012, 12:48

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 20:43

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

nilsbloodaxe wrote:shield reform has made shields much better

Which shield reform and how?
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Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 20:52

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Quick update after Elf clearing, it was a real joke !

Would you use Hat of Pondering, or is it really too much slowness... (but great Slouch :twisted: )

  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15.1-1-gfacfea3 (webtiles) character file.

mopl the Black Belt (Octopode Transmuter)          Turns: 55095, Time: 04:20:10

HP 151/151 (157) AC  5     Str 24      XL: 23   Next: 29%
MP  47/47        EV 31     Int 36      God: Cheibriados [******]
Gold 3565        SH  0     Dex 38      Spells:  9 memorised,  9 levels left

rFire  + . .     SeeInvis +       - Unarmed
rCold  + + +     Clarity  .     (no shield)
rNeg   + + .     rCorr    .     L - +2 hat
rPois  .         rRot     .     I - amulet "Chisel" {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
rElec  +         Spirit   .     c - ring of see invisible
SustAb .         Warding  .     z - ring of protection from cold
rMut   .         Stasis   +     d - +2 ring of protection
Gourm  .                        B - ring of regeneration
MR     +++..                    Y - ring of protection from magic
                                t - ring "Bruhung" {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
                                e - ring "Chughi" {rN+ Dex+3 Int+3}
                                h - ring of regeneration

@: mildly poisoned, studying Stealth, deflect missiles, very slow, extremely
resistant to hostile enchantments, incredibly stealthy
A: almost no armour, amphibious, 8 rings, constrict 8, camouflage 1, magic
resistance 1, sense surroundings 1, gelatinous body 1
a: Bend Time, Temporal Distortion, Slouch, Step From Time, Renounce Religion,
Evoke Invisibility
}: 1/15 runes: serpentine


You are on level 3 of the Elven Halls.
You worship Cheibriados.
Cheibriados is exalted by your worship.
You are full.

You have visited 9 branches of the dungeon, and seen 47 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 2 times.
You have also visited: Volcano and Wizlab.

You have collected 6153 gold pieces.
You have spent 2588 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 b - a +0 blowgun
Missiles
 n - 29 curare-tipped needles
 W - 296 arrows
 Z - 2 throwing nets (quivered)
Armour
 k - the +3 hat of Pondering {ponderous, MR+ MP+10 Int+5}
   (You found it on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+5).
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It affects your magic capacity (+10).
 p - the +8 large shield of the Jabberwock {Int+1 Slay+6}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Abyss)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+1).
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+6).
 L - a +2 hat (worn)
Magical devices
 q - a wand of lightning
 r - a wand of cold {zapped: 4}
 v - a wand of digging (16)
 w - a wand of teleportation (3)
 C - a wand of invisibility (4)
 F - a wand of draining (7)
 G - a wand of cold {zapped: 4}
 H - a wand of disintegration
 M - a wand of fireball {zapped: 2}
Comestibles
 a - 22 bread rations
Scrolls
 i - 19 scrolls of identify
 j - 9 scrolls of fog
 o - 23 scrolls of remove curse
 y - 15 scrolls of teleportation
 K - 4 scrolls of fear
 O - 4 scrolls of magic mapping
 Q - 6 scrolls of blinking
 R - 2 scrolls of summoning
 U - 5 scrolls of immolation
Jewellery
 c - a ring of see invisible (left tentacle)
 d - a +2 ring of protection (on tentacle)
 e - the ring "Chughi" (on tentacle) {rN+ Dex+3 Int+3}
   (You took it off an unborn on level 3 of the Crypt)   
   
   [ring of positive energy]
   
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
   It affects your dexterity (+3).
   It protects you from negative energy.
 h - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 t - the ring "Bruhung" (on tentacle) {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 3 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   [ring of magical power]
   
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It makes you more stealthy.
 z - a ring of protection from cold (right tentacle)
 B - a ring of regeneration (on tentacle)
 D - the ring of Zotoj {+Fly rElec rF+ rC- Str+3}
   (You took it off a deep elf annihilator on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of flight]
   
   It affects your strength (+3).
   It protects you from fire.
   It makes you vulnerable to cold.
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It lets you fly.
 I - the amulet "Chisel" (around mantle) {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
   (You found it on level 6 of the Dungeon)   
   
   [amulet of stasis]
   
   It prevents you from being teleported, slowed, hasted or paralysed.
   It protects you from fire.
   It greatly protects you from cold.
   It protects you from negative energy.
 X - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
 Y - a ring of protection from magic (on tentacle)
Potions
 m - a potion of heal wounds
 x - 7 potions of might
 A - 3 potions of cancellation
 J - 12 potions of curing
 N - 3 potions of resistance
 P - 5 potions of agility
 T - 4 potions of invisibility
Books
 l - Lee's Almanac of Attacks
   (You found it on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   Spells                             Type                      Level
   Flame Tongue                       Conjuration/Fire             1
   Sticky Flame                       Conjuration/Fire             4
   Iskenderun's Battlesphere          Conjuration/Charms           5
 s - the Volume of Arcane Weapons and Heat
   (You found it on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   Spells                             Type                      Level
   Flame Tongue                       Conjuration/Fire             1
   Magic Dart                         Conjuration                  1
   Bolt of Magma                      Conjuration/Fire/Earth       5
   Poisonous Cloud                    Conjuration/Poison/Air       6
   Delayed Fireball                   Conjuration/Fire             7
 V - a manual of Stealth
Magical staves
 E - a thin jewelled staff
Miscellaneous
 f - a phial of floods
 g - a plain deck of defence {drawn: 2}
 u - a phial of floods
 S - a plain deck of summonings {drawn: 2}


   Skills:
 - Level 13.0 Fighting
 - Level 13.0 Dodging
 - Level 15.0 Stealth
 + Level 11.3 Shields
 - Level 19.0 Unarmed Combat
 - Level 11.3 Spellcasting
 - Level 10.0 Charms
 - Level 3.0 Necromancy
 - Level 11.0 Transmutations
   Level 3.0 Ice Magic
 - Level 10.0 Air Magic
 - Level 11.0 Earth Magic
 - Level 5.6 Poison Magic
 - Level 13.0 Invocations
 - Level 10.5 Evocations


You have 9 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
b - Statue Form           Trmt/Erth      #######..    4%          6    ####...
d - Blade Hands           Trmt           #######...   1%          5    None
i - Deflect Missiles      Chrm/Air       #######...   8%          6    ####...
k - Lee's Rapid Deconstr  Erth           #######...   1%          5    None
p - Passwall              Trmt/Erth      #######...   1%          3    None
r - Regeneration          Chrm/Necr      ######....   1%          3    None
s - Stoneskin             Trmt/Erth      #######.     1%          2    None
A - Spider Form           Trmt/Pois      ######....   1%          3    None
W - Sticks to Snakes      Trmt           #######...   1%          2    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:5             Orc (4/4) D:10
    Elf (3/3) Orc:4          Lair (8/8) D:8           Swamp (5/5) Lair:6
  Snake (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:6       Vaults (3/5) D:13
  Crypt (3/3) Vaults:3       Tomb (0/3) Crypt:3      Depths (0/5) D:15

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh

Shops:
D:5 (   D:14 (   Orc:3 =   Orc:4 [[(!?   Elf:2 %   Vaults:1 *   Vaults:2 *

Annotations:
Swamp:5 Mara
Snake:4 exclusion: 2 naga sharpshooters, Vashnia


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You cannot wear most types of armour.
You are amphibious.
You can wear up to eight rings at the same time.
You can use your tentacles to constrict many enemies at once.
Your skin changes colour to match your surroundings (Stealth).
Your rubbery body absorbs attacks (AC +1).
You are resistant to hostile enchantments.
You passively map a small area around you.


Message History

You feel sick.
No target in view!
No target in view!
Unknown command.
You feel very sick.
Unknown command.
You feel sick.
You feel very sick.
You feel sick.
You start resting. You feel sick.
You feel sick. x36
HP restored.
You start waiting.
You feel sick.
HP restored.
Char dumped successfully.
Items here: % ) // : = ???? }}
Okay, then.
Unknown command.
Saving game... please wait.

##...(.###.###..P..##?.)).##
)###..##.....##..###).###()###
...####.......####..)## ##|..#
##.#§§...........#:###   ###.#
##.#.............#[##     ##.#
#..'......⌠......'[.#     #).#
##.#.............#.##     ##.#
##)#..........=..#(###   ###.#
...#...........:@#.).## ##..(#
)######.......######).###}.###
##    ##.....##    ##.)).)##
#      ###.###      ###.###
         ###          ###


There are no monsters in sight!
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125
User avatar

Pandemonium Purger

Posts: 1337

Joined: Saturday, 7th July 2012, 02:28

Location: Limbo

Post Friday, 19th September 2014, 21:23

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

It's free +1 AC, +5 Int, +MP and MR+; what's not to love?
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

Did you know that I like ruining crawl every now and then? Go check it out.

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 5333

Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36

Post Saturday, 20th September 2014, 01:17

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

So I'm a bit late to the party, but as this is perhaps my favorite combo, and one I've won, I'll lay out the basics.

Statue form vs dragon might be debatable in general, but statue form with 8 rings vs dragon form with 2 rings is no question. Statue form is generally a must have for OpTm's and FeTm's who have no armor, imho.

The regeneration spell should be auto-learned on basically every character who isn't worshipping trog, and the number of regeneration rings you have doesn't change that, they all stack. While I still managed to die, this character was quite hilarious: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=12408&p=174715&hilit=regenopode#p174715

It's absolutely worth it to train for shields, although you'll prefer either a buckler or medium shield. That large shield might be worth it if you're going for 15 runes and you want to upgrade much later on, but I wouldn't rush for it. Slaying is fairly moot when you're in statue form because your damage is insanely high. Resistances/ac/ev would be better. .15 shields are slightly stronger overall, and as mentioned Op's don't lose the offhand punch when using one.

I'd use the hat of pondering, sure.

For reference here's my OpTm of chei: http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/tasonir/mor ... 105635.txt

For this message the author tasonir has received thanks:
mopl
User avatar

Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Saturday, 20th September 2014, 08:02

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Bloax wrote:It's free +1 AC, +5 Int, +MP and MR+; what's not to love?

Free ? Or very little cost ? ;)
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125
User avatar

Pandemonium Purger

Posts: 1337

Joined: Saturday, 7th July 2012, 02:28

Location: Limbo

Post Saturday, 20th September 2014, 10:39

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

You already move slower than molasses, so it is completely free. (Unless your deathly fear of "what if the enemies get three actions in a row????" is too strong, which would be surprising if you've already played with Chei.)
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

Did you know that I like ruining crawl every now and then? Go check it out.

For this message the author Bloax has received thanks:
mopl
User avatar

Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Saturday, 20th September 2014, 11:04

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Bloax wrote:You already move slower than molasses, so it is completely free. (Unless your deathly fear of "what if the enemies get three actions in a row????" is too strong, which would be surprising if you've already played with Chei.)
Sequell wrote:3 games for mopl (won god=chei): NaAr, TrMo, VSCK
I'm not afraid, but more than some of you guys
Sequell wrote:10 games for Bloax (won god=chei): 2x GrMo, TeFi, DDTm, DEWz, OgHu, VSTm, TrTm, OgBe, DEBe
20 games for tasonir (won god=chei): 3x NaHu, 2x TrMo, 2x GrMo, 2x NaMo, TrAM, OpEE, FeTm, GrEE, SETm, DrTm, NaFi, OpTm, VSTm, FoHu, DsMo
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125
User avatar

Slime Squisher

Posts: 338

Joined: Wednesday, 20th November 2013, 11:37

Post Monday, 22nd September 2014, 11:50

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Bloax wrote:It's free +1 AC, +5 Int, +MP and MR+; what's not to love?

As for me, only characters with basic speed and tengu(11 speed while flying iirc) should avoid this hat. There are 2 hard breakpoints in crawl: slower-normal and normal-faster, all is relative to 10 speed. And if pondering makes you go through one of this breakpoint then you are definitely loose a lot. Otherwise the speed cost is negligible.
User avatar

Pandemonium Purger

Posts: 1337

Joined: Saturday, 7th July 2012, 02:28

Location: Limbo

Post Monday, 22nd September 2014, 12:59

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

If you benefit a lot from the int/mp/MR then I'd say it's still worth it due to how small this disadvantage it poses upon you is. (It's one extra move every 10 steps. Whoah!)
take it easy
  Code:
!lg * won !DD-- min=turns -log
<Sequell> 20749. Bloax, XL24 VSTm, T:13320: http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/Bloax/morgue-Bloax-20140907-000920.txt

Did you know that I like ruining crawl every now and then? Go check it out.
User avatar

Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Monday, 22nd September 2014, 14:49

Re: CiP : OpTm^Chei, real shield or Condensation ?

Yeeha !

New personal best score, new Bone and Icy (69 turns oO) lowest turncounts, my first diesel char and same max Op-EV as Monsoon record (I remeber I had a +2EV ring lying somewhere... :x )

Also I think that 57 Dex is a new record too :P

Very fun run, Op with >40AC feel really awesome !

  Code:
ungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15.1-1-gfacfea3 (webtiles) character file.

17223427 mopl the Intangible (level 27, 263/263 HPs)
             Began as an Octopode Transmuter on Sept 19, 2014.
             Was the Champion of Cheibriados.
             Escaped with the Orb
             ... and 15 runes on Sept 22, 2014!
             
             The game lasted 09:27:05 (90312 turns).

mopl the Intangible (Octopode Transmuter)          Turns: 90312, Time: 09:27:05

HP 263/263       AC 47     Str 37      XL: 27
MP  42/53        EV 69     Int 49      God: Cheibriados [******]
Gold 10611       SH 40     Dex 57      Spells: 16 memorised,  0 levels left

rFire  + + +     SeeInvis .       - Unarmed
rCold  + . .     Clarity  .     p - +8 large shield of the Jabberwock {Int+1 Slay+6}
rNeg   + + +     rCorr    .     k - +3 hat of Pondering {ponderous, MR+ MP+10 Int+5}
rPois  +         rRot     +     I - amulet "Chisel" {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
rElec  +         Spirit   .     q - ring of Lies {Dex+1 Slay+6}
SustAb +         Warding  .     l - ring of Nuseul Uliwo {rC+ Int+2 Stlth++}
rMut   .         Stasis   +     e - ring "Chughi" {rN+ Dex+3 Int+3}
Gourm  .                        W - ring of Xom's Delight {Fire Dex+4 Int+5}
MR     +++..                    M - ring of Wirun {EV+1 Str+1 Dex+5}
                                z - ring "Gaahus" {SustAb +Inv rF+ rN+}
                                v - ring of Shaolin {EV+8}
                                E - ring "Naschoink" {Fire Str+4 Dex+4}

@: mighty, agile, statue-form, phasing, stone skin, deflect missiles, very slow,
extremely resistant to hostile enchantments, quite stealthy
A: almost no armour, amphibious, 8 rings, constrict 8, camouflage 1, (gelatinous
body 0)
a: End Transformation, Bend Time, Temporal Distortion, Slouch, Step From Time,
Renounce Religion, Evoke Invisibility
0: Orb of Zot
}: 15/15 runes: decaying, serpentine, slimy, silver, golden, iron, obsidian,
icy, bone, abyssal, demonic, glowing, magical, fiery, dark


You escaped.
You worshipped Cheibriados.
Cheibriados was exalted by your worship.
You were not hungry.

You were a stone statue.

You visited 18 branches of the dungeon, and saw 97 of its levels.
You visited Pandemonium 1 time, and saw 22 of its levels.
You visited the Abyss 4 times.
You visited 1 Ziggurat, and saw 21 of its levels.
You also visited: Volcano and Wizlab.

You collected 13876 gold pieces.
You spent 3260 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Missiles
 Z - 8 throwing nets (quivered)
Armour
 k - the +3 hat of Pondering (worn) {ponderous, MR+ MP+10 Int+5}
   (You found it on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+5).
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It affects your magic capacity (+10).
 p - the +8 large shield of the Jabberwock (worn) {Int+1 Slay+6}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Abyss)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+1).
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+6).
Magical devices
 g - a wand of digging (19)
 w - a wand of teleportation (7)
 C - a wand of invisibility (4)
 D - a wand of teleportation (5)
 G - a wand of heal wounds (4)
 H - a wand of disintegration (11)
Comestibles
 a - 49 bread rations
Scrolls
 i - 13 scrolls of identify
 j - 16 scrolls of fog
 o - 34 scrolls of remove curse
 s - a scroll of recharging
 y - 23 scrolls of teleportation
 K - 11 scrolls of fear
 O - 2 scrolls of magic mapping
 Q - 17 scrolls of blinking
 R - 3 scrolls of summoning
 S - 7 scrolls of holy word
Jewellery
 c - an uncursed ring of see invisible
 e - the ring "Chughi" (on tentacle) {rN+ Dex+3 Int+3}
   (You took it off an unborn on level 3 of the Crypt)   
   
   [ring of positive energy]
   
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
   It affects your dexterity (+3).
   It protects you from negative energy.
 f - the ring "Busiuxt" {Wiz +Inv rElec Int+4}
   (You found it on level 19 of a ziggurat)   
   
   [ring of wizardry]
   
   It improves your spell success rate.
   It affects your intelligence (+4).
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It lets you turn invisible.
 h - an uncursed ring of regeneration
 l - the ring of Nuseul Uliwo (right tentacle) {rC+ Int+2 Stlth++}
   (You found it on level 17 of a ziggurat)   
   
   [ring of protection from cold]
   
   It affects your intelligence (+2).
   It protects you from cold.
   It makes you much more stealthy.
 n - an uncursed ring of teleportation
 q - the ring of Lies (left tentacle) {Dex+1 Slay+6}
   (You acquired it on level 8 of a ziggurat)   
   
   [ring of slaying]
   
   It affects your dexterity (+1).
   It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
   (+6).
 r - the ring "Qeimeedd" {rElec rF+}
   (You took it off a green draconian on level 4 of the Realm of Zot)   
   
   [ring of protection from fire]
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It insulates you from electricity.
 t - the ring "Bruhung" {+Inv rElec MP+9 Stlth+}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 3 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   [ring of magical power]
   
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It makes you more stealthy.
 v - the ring of Shaolin (on tentacle) {EV+8}
   (You found it on level 20 of a ziggurat)   
   
   [ring of evasion]
   
   It affects your evasion (+8).
 z - the ring "Gaahus" (on tentacle) {SustAb +Inv rF+ rN+}
   (You found it on level 7 of the Iron City of Dis)   
   
   [ring of sustain abilities]
   
   It sustains your strength, intelligence and dexterity.
   It protects you from fire.
   It protects you from negative energy.
   It lets you turn invisible.
 B - an uncursed ring of regeneration
 E - the ring "Naschoink" (on tentacle) {Fire Str+4 Dex+4}
   (You found it on level 7 of the Iron City of Dis)   
   
   [ring of fire]
   
   It enhances your fire magic, and weakens your ice magic.
   It affects your strength (+4).
   It affects your dexterity (+4).
   It protects you from fire.
   It makes you vulnerable to cold.
 I - the amulet "Chisel" (around mantle) {Stasis rF+ rC++ rN+}
   (You found it on level 6 of the Dungeon)   
   
   [amulet of stasis]
   
   It prevents you from being teleported, slowed, hasted or paralysed.
   It protects you from fire.
   It greatly protects you from cold.
   It protects you from negative energy.
 M - the ring of Wirun (on tentacle) {EV+1 Str+1 Dex+5}
   (You found it on level 17 of a ziggurat)   
   
   [ring of evasion]
   
   It affects your evasion (+1).
   It affects your strength (+1).
   It affects your dexterity (+5).
 W - the ring of Xom's Delight (on tentacle) {Fire Dex+4 Int+5}
   (You found it on level 4 of a ziggurat)   
   
   [ring of fire]
   
   It enhances your fire magic, and weakens your ice magic.
   It affects your intelligence (+5).
   It affects your dexterity (+4).
   It protects you from fire.
   It makes you vulnerable to cold.
 X - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
 Y - an uncursed ring of protection from magic
Potions
 m - 11 potions of heal wounds
 x - 7 potions of might
 A - 5 potions of cancellation
 J - 22 potions of curing
 N - 3 potions of resistance
 P - 4 potions of agility
 T - 8 potions of cure mutation
 U - 4 potions of restore abilities
Miscellaneous
 b - a legendary deck of changes {the Elixir, drawn: 5}
 d - a fan of gales
 u - a phial of floods
 V - a crystal ball of energy


   Skills:
 + Level 20.5 Fighting
 O Level 27 Dodging
 - Level 22.6 Stealth
 - Level 25.0 Shields
 + Level 22.4 Unarmed Combat
 - Level 22.0 Spellcasting
 - Level 10.0 Charms
 - Level 15.0 Necromancy
 - Level 11.0 Translocations
 - Level 18.0 Transmutations
   Level 3.0 Ice Magic
 - Level 10.0 Air Magic
 - Level 24.2 Earth Magic
   Level 5.6 Poison Magic
 - Level 13.0 Invocations
 - Level 16.0 Evocations


You couldn't memorise any spells.
You knew the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Apportation           Tloc           ########..   0%          1    None
b - Statue Form           Trmt/Erth      ########.    0%          6    None
c - Silence               Hex/Air        #######...   1%          5    None
e - Blink                 Tloc           N/A          0%          2    None
f - Flight                Chrm/Air       ########..   0%          3    None
g - Phase Shift           Tloc           ########..   1%          5    None
i - Deflect Missiles      Chrm/Air       ########..   1%          6    None
k - Lee's Rapid Deconstr  Erth           ########..   0%          5    None
m - Summon Butterflies    Summ           ######..     1%          1    None
p - Passwall              Trmt/Erth      ########..   0%          3    None
r - Regeneration          Chrm/Necr      ########..   0%          3    None
s - Stoneskin             Trmt/Erth      ########     0%          2    None
C - Control Teleport      Chrm/Tloc      ########..   1%          4    None
E - Controlled Blink      Tloc           N/A          2%          7    None
M - Shatter               Erth           ########..   1%          9    None
N - Necromutation         Trmt/Necr      ########..   1%          8    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:5             Orc (4/4) D:10
    Elf (3/3) Orc:4          Lair (8/8) D:8           Swamp (5/5) Lair:6
  Snake (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (6/6) Lair:6       Vaults (5/5) D:13
  Crypt (3/3) Vaults:3       Tomb (3/3) Crypt:3      Depths (5/5) D:15
   Hell (1/1)                 Dis (7/7) Hell            Geh (7/7) Hell
    Coc (7/7) Hell            Tar (7/7) Hell            Zot (5/5) Depths:5

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh
Jiyva

Shops:
D:5 (   D:14 (   Orc:3 =   Orc:4 [[(!?   Elf:2 %   Vaults:1 *   Vaults:2 *
Vaults:4 [   Vaults:5 }*

Portals:
Hell: Depths:1 Depths:2 Depths:3 Depths:4 Depths:5
Abyss: Depths:3 Depths:4
Pandemonium: Depths:3 Depths:5

Annotations:
Snake:4 exclusion: 2 naga sharpshooters, Vashnia
Depths:2 prot shield


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You cannot wear most types of armour.
You are amphibious.
You can wear up to eight rings at the same time.
You can use your tentacles to constrict many enemies at once.
Your skin changes colour to match your surroundings (Stealth).
((Your rubbery body absorbs attacks (AC +1).))


Message History

Put on which piece of jewellery? (? for menu, Esc to quit)
You're wearing all the rings you can. Remove which one?
(? for menu, Esc to cancel)
1 or r - the ring "Qeimeedd" {rElec rF+}
2 or l - the ring of Nuseul Uliwo {rC+ Int+2 Stlth++}
3 or e - the ring "Chughi" {rN+ Dex+3 Int+3}
4 or W - the ring of Xom's Delight {Fire Dex+4 Int+5}
5 or M - the ring of Wirun {EV+1 Str+1 Dex+5}
6 or z - the ring "Gaahus" {SustAb +Inv rF+ rN+}
7 or v - the ring of Shaolin {EV+8}
8 or E - the ring "Naschoink" {Fire Str+4 Dex+4}
You remove the ring "Qeimeedd" {rElec rF+}.
q - the ring of Lies (left tentacle) {Dex+1 Slay+6}
Casting: Phase Shift
Confirm with . or Enter, or press ? or * to list all spells.
You turn into a living statue of rough stone.
Casting: Statue Form
Confirm with . or Enter, or press ? or * to list all spells.
Your stone body feels more resilient.
You have escaped!

   #..........##.....#   #...%...
   #[.........##.....#   #..)....
   #.........###.....#   #.......
   #.........# #######   ##.###..
   #####..#.##            #......
       #.##..###          #.###..
      ##.#.....####      ##.# #..
      #..#........##  ####..###..
      #.##......8..####......##..
      #.#....##.....##..###..##..
##    #.#...######.....###..#.#..
.#    #.#...##   ##...##...###...
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There were no monsters in sight!
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 5333

Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36

Post Monday, 22nd September 2014, 22:29

Re: YAVP : OpTm^Chei, just awesome

Definitely a beastly octopode :) You had me beat by 7 dex and 8 EV, although I did have +1 ac! Go go +2 ring of protection, ha. One day I'll repeat the combo and just zig farm until I get 3-4 protection rings, the brooch of shielding, and can finally set AC+EV records ;)
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Dis Charger

Posts: 1939

Joined: Monday, 18th February 2013, 07:59

Location: France

Post Tuesday, 23rd September 2014, 08:14

Re: YAVP : OpTm^Chei, just awesome

tasonir wrote:Definitely a beastly octopode :) You had me beat by 7 dex and 8 EV, although I did have +1 ac! Go go +2 ring of protection, ha. One day I'll repeat the combo and just zig farm until I get 3-4 protection rings, the brooch of shielding, and can finally set AC+EV records ;)
No, no, that's MY idea... unless I try Op greatrace...
Online stats
Fastest Hell runes (enter Hell branch -> get the rune)
Icy : 56 / Iron : 126 / Obsidian : 215 / Bone : 125

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 5333

Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36

Post Wednesday, 24th September 2014, 01:41

Re: YAVP : OpTm^Chei, just awesome

The surest way to ensure you won't find multiple rings of protection is to play an octopode :)

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