CIP: NaAr, Nemelex UD: Again


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Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Tuesday, 6th May 2014, 01:19

Post Sunday, 11th May 2014, 01:04

CIP: NaAr, Nemelex UD: Again

Hey, just posting my progress-- it's getting more interesting.


I 'tabbed' my way through the Elven Halls and found myself drained by a ridiculous amount-- I thought Experience Cards may solve that, so I top-decked ALL of my wonder decks. I gained like... 10 levels, or something, as a result and am now at 27. I had a decent randart scale mail, so I decided to put some of that in armor. I also found a stlth++ randart mace. I know it's low dmg, but it's good utility-- I think.

Mid Mortem: Decks of Wonder are really fricken strong with Nagas. Due to all the innates, the bad stuff that could happen just simply doesn't matter, and all the good stuff that could happen is obnoxiously good.


  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.14.0 (tiles) character file.

Amadine the Evocator (Naga Artificer)              Turns: 50719, Time: 05:44:50

HP 252/252       AC 22     Str 11      XL: 27
MP  43/43        EV 10     Int 23      God: Nemelex Xobeh [******]
Gold 2559        SH 22     Dex 22      Spells:  0 memorised, 26 levels left

rFire  + + .     SeeInvis +     X - +0,+10 mace of the Thirteen Songs {elec, Int-1 Stlth++}
rCold  . . .     Rnd*Rage +     w - +6 scale mail "Ebren" {rF+ Acc+4}
rNeg   . . .     Conserve .     b - +3 shield "Gaqounge" {Int+3}
rPois  +         rCorr    .     (helmet restricted)
rElec  .         rRot     .     g - +0 cloak
SustAb . .       Spirit   .     Z - +1 pair of gloves {Dex+3}
rMut   .         Warding  .     (no barding)
Gourm  +         Stasis   .     e - amulet of the gourmand
MR     ++++.                    s - +5 ring of evasion
                                x - ring of protection from magic

@: sage [Evocations, Staves, Bows, Fighting, Stealth, Stealth, Shields,
Evocations, Stealth, Evocations, Armour, Short Blades, Stealth, Stealth, Short
Blades, Evocations, Fighting, Stealth], very heavily drained, very slow,
incredibly resistant to hostile enchantments, extremely stealthy
A: spit poison, constrict 1, horns 2, see invisible, berserk 1, breathe flames
1, deformed body, deterioration 1, fire resistance 1, poison resistance,
regeneration 1, slowness 2, AC +9
a: Spit Poison, Draw One, Peek at Two, Triple Draw, Deal Four, Stack Five,
Renounce Religion, Breathe Fire


You are on level 1 of the Shoals.
You worship Nemelex Xobeh.
Nemelex Xobeh is exalted by your worship.
You are full.

You have visited 6 branches of the dungeon, and seen 32 of its levels.
You have visited 1 bazaar.
You have also visited: Labyrinth.

You have collected 3580 gold pieces.
You have spent 1021 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 h - the +9,+8 morningstar of Midnight {speed, *Rage +Blink SInv}
   (You bought it in a shop in a bazaar)   
   
   Attacks with this weapon are significantly faster.
   
   It enhances your eyesight.
   It lets you blink.
   It may make you go berserk in combat.
 X - the +0,+10 mace of the Thirteen Songs (weapon) {elec, Int-1 Stlth++}
   (You took it off a deep elf annihilator on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   Occasionally, upon striking a foe, it will discharge some electrical energy
   and cause terrible harm.
   
   It affects your intelligence (-1).
   It makes you much more stealthy.
Armour
 b - the +3 shield "Gaqounge" (worn) {Int+3}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
 g - a +0 cloak (worn)
 w - the +6 scale mail "Ebren" (worn) {rF+ Acc+4}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 4 of the Orcish Mines)   
   
   It affects your accuracy with ranged weapons and melee attacks (+4).
   It protects you from fire.
 Z - a +1 pair of gloves of dexterity (worn)
Comestibles
 i - 16 bread rations
Scrolls
 A - 3 scrolls of remove curse
 G - 3 scrolls of blinking
 R - 3 scrolls of teleportation
 U - 3 scrolls of identify
Jewellery
 e - an amulet of the gourmand (around neck)
 s - a +5 ring of evasion (right hand)
 x - a ring of protection from magic (left hand)
 O - an uncursed ring of protection from cold
 Q - an uncursed ring of protection from fire
Potions
 d - 3 potions of heal wounds
 k - 4 potions of curing
 n - a potion of haste
Miscellaneous
 c - a plain deck of escape {drawn: 1}
 y - an ornate deck of destruction {drawn: 2}
 z - an ornate deck of summonings {drawn: 1}
 D - an ornate deck of destruction {the Orb, drawn: 3}
 I - an ornate deck of summonings {drawn: 1}
 K - an ornate deck of destruction {drawn: 1}
Rods
 E - a +9 rod of clouds (17/17)
   (You found it in a labyrinth)
 L - a +0 lightning rod (13/13)
   (You found it on level 4 of the Lair of Beasts)


   Skills:
 + Level 15.9(9.9) Fighting
   Level 1.7(0.0) Short Blades
 - Level 9.1(3.9) Maces & Flails
   Level 3.3(0.0) Staves
   Level 2.2(0.0) Bows
   Level 3.2(0.0) Crossbows
 - Level 9.8(4.5) Armour
 + Level 10.8(5.4) Dodging
 - Level 19.0(12.5) Stealth
 - Level 9.3(4.1) Shields
 * Level 23.5(16.5) Evocations


You have 26 spell levels left.
You don't know any spells.

Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:6             Orc (4/4) D:11
    Elf (3/3) Orc:3          Lair (8/8) D:11         Shoals (1/5) Lair:3
 Spider (0/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:8       Vaults (0/5) D:14
 Depths (0/5) D:15       


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You cannot wear boots.
You can spit poison.
You can use your snake-like lower body to constrict enemies.
Your serpentine skin is tough (AC +9).
You have supernaturally acute eyesight.
Armour fits poorly on your strangely shaped body.
Your system is resistant to poisons.
You cover ground very slowly.
You have a pair of horns on your head.
You tend to lose your temper in combat.
You can breathe flames.
Your body is slowly deteriorating.
Your flesh is heat resistant.
Your natural rate of healing is unusually fast.



OP History:
Spoiler: show
Thanks for the advice. I easily ate the lair up and, feeling adventurous after the fact, top-decked an entire normal deck of wonders. I pulled 3 experience cards, saged shields/evo, and lost harmful mutations, replaced with an upgrade to my spit poison O_O.

I think that the cards/rod usage is heavily stacked toward high evo. I notice that my Rod of Clouds typically picks the best cloud for the target enemy population.

Anyways, I used the experience cards to bump my shields to 9, to eliminate the common shield penalty (may do something similar later if I find a good armor), and fill out evo/fighting/dodging further. Still haven't had a need to focus a weapon skill, so I'll probably just bet on more experience cards later.

I have 6/10 un-IDed legendary/ornate decks, and a wonder in each already- so... I'm looking forward to seeing what other wonky things I can do. I have like a dozen DoS/DoD that I don't need.

Questions:

I found a book of Translocations that I didn't immediately throw away. Is this one worth bumping up assuming more Experience cards?

I also found a Rod of Lightning +0- is this one worth upgrading? I already bumped clouds up to +9 because I was wrecking house with it.

I have 3 Scrolls of Acquirement. Am I right to want to split these up between Rods and Armor?

My stash has gotten quite huge with wands, rings, scrolls and other things I'm not immediately using. I have a robe of resist and rings of protection (fire/cold/magic) in inventory, but also ice/fire/flight/teleport-- Should I be carrying flight/teleport with me?

Should I ditch Gourmand for Stasis? I really like Gourmand- it's allow me to return to my Stash as frequently as I want, and supports my Beserking Mace and Poison Spitting habit. I also have a stockpile of food that is getting very large. About when should I be switching to Stasis? Or what other amulets should I be looking out for? Is conservation the best?

  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.14.0 (tiles) character file.

Amadine the Fetichist (Naga Artificer)             Turns: 38399, Time: 04:14:57

HP 181/181       AC 12     Str 12      XL: 18   Next: 58%
MP  36/36        EV 25     Int 16      God: Nemelex Xobeh [******]
Gold 1491        SH 27     Dex 23 (24) Spells:  0 memorised, 17 levels left

rFire  + . .     SeeInvis +     h - +9,+8 morningstar of Midnight {speed, *Rage +Blink SInv}
rCold  + . .     Rnd*Rage +     i - +2 robe {rC+ rF+}
rNeg   . . .     Conserve .     b - +3 shield "Gaqounge" {Int+3}
rPois  +         rCorr    .     (helmet restricted)
rElec  .         rRot     .     g - +0 cloak
SustAb . .       Spirit   .     Z - +1 pair of gloves {Dex+3}
rMut   .         Warding  .     (no barding)
Gourm  +         Stasis   .     e - amulet of the gourmand
MR     ++...                    s - +5 ring of evasion
                                (no ring)

@: short of breath, sage [Evocations, Shields, Bows], very slow, very resistant
to hostile enchantments, extraordinarily stealthy
A: breathe poison, constrict 1, horns 1, see invisible, breathe poison, deformed
body, sense surroundings 1, poison resistance, slowness 2, AC +6
a: Breathe Poison Gas, Draw One, Peek at Two, Triple Draw, Deal Four, Stack
Five, Renounce Religion, Evoke Blink


You are on level 14 of the Dungeon.
You worship Nemelex Xobeh.
Nemelex Xobeh is exalted by your worship.
You are full.

You have visited 3 branches of the dungeon, and seen 24 of its levels.
You have visited 1 bazaar.
You have also visited: Labyrinth.

You have collected 1779 gold pieces.
You have spent 288 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 h - the +9,+8 morningstar of Midnight (weapon) {speed, *Rage +Blink SInv}
   (You bought it in a shop in a bazaar)   
   
   Attacks with this weapon are significantly faster.
   
   It enhances your eyesight.
   It lets you blink.
   It may make you go berserk in combat.
Armour
 b - the +3 shield "Gaqounge" (worn) {Int+3}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
 g - a +0 cloak (worn)
 i - a +2 robe of resistance (worn)
 Z - a +1 pair of gloves of dexterity (worn)
Magical devices
 w - a wand of enslavement (4)
 X - a wand of flame (5)
Comestibles
 f - 16 bread rations
Scrolls
 A - 4 scrolls of remove curse
 R - 5 scrolls of teleportation
 U - 4 scrolls of identify
Jewellery
 e - an amulet of the gourmand (around neck)
 s - a +5 ring of evasion (right hand)
 x - an uncursed ring of protection from magic
 O - an uncursed ring of protection from cold
 Q - an uncursed ring of protection from fire
Potions
 d - 4 potions of heal wounds
 k - 6 potions of curing
Miscellaneous
 m - a plain deck of summonings {drawn: 1}
 p - a plain deck of destruction {drawn: 1}
Rods
 E - a +9 rod of clouds (17/17)
   (You found it in a labyrinth)


   Skills:
 + Level 15.6 Fighting
   Level 1.0 Short Blades
   Level 3.2 Crossbows
 + Level 10.6 Dodging
 - Level 17.0 Stealth
 - Level 9.0 Shields
 * Level 18.2 Evocations


You have 17 spell levels left.
You don't know any spells.


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You cannot wear boots.
You can use your snake-like lower body to constrict enemies.
Your serpentine skin is tough (AC +6).
You have supernaturally acute eyesight.
Armour fits poorly on your strangely shaped body.
Your system is resistant to poisons.
You cover ground very slowly.
You have a pair of small horns on your head.
You can exhale a cloud of poison.
You passively map a small area around you.






Previous OP.
[spoiler]I've really been loving Naga Artificers. I'm still a noob, but I think this run might have a good chance for a win.

My approach so far has been to focus on fighing, stealth, and evocations. In conjunction with Naga innate abilities and starting wands, it guarantees a LOT of progress. I can flexibly use the best weapon I find + poison to fight fodder, and then fall back on decks and wands as win-buttons against actual threats. Evocable translocations + stealth make up for my ineptitude. I've skipped Mines/Lair, as I've never done them before I figured I'd stick with clearing out the main dungeon first. I have a stash of some nice things, but a lot of it I just gave to Neme, unsure of what to really do with any of it... probably could've branched into magic with an experience card, but I don't know anything about the spells in this game.

So... Questions.

I HAVE NO WEAPON SKILL AT ALL. Does my current weapon justify maces? +9,+8 morningstar of Midnight {speed, *Rage +Blink SInv}
Is that an end-game weapon? I don't really need a weapon skill at this point, but it's easy to get one up to a decent delay and I should stop putting it off. I want to stick to relying on Evocables for threats-- how much do I need for a decent attack speed?

I have 2 scrolls of acquirement stashed. I was going to hold off until I had some barding (filling all slots) to guarantee artifact armor, but I was thinking of shooting for some Rods also. I have a Rod of Clouds right now which is pretty fun atm.


How much shields should I go for? At 9, medium shields are free for Nagas- I was going for this. Are large shields worth an extra 6 levels?

How much evasion should I go for? I only have 7, but I neglected it having found an EV ring and the fact that Nagas are tanks. I do get hit, but I soak, dodge, and block enough that I seem okay right now. More fighting for more HP to take better advantage of AC seemed like a good idea- but I'm really not familiar with how the combat mechanics work.

Stealth is probably high enough, at what point is it definitely too high? Do See Invis monsters see through stealth, or just invisibility? I'm not looking for Stabbing Bonuses, just the extra couple of turns to have a jump and be able to translocate safely.

How much evocation is too much? I mean- it doesn't seem to have diminishing returns. Apart from needing to diversify and get a faster weapon + better defense, can I still improve evo?

Should I continue focusing on Dex? Or is Str a better choice for me now that I may focus more on Mace & Shield?


Also, I found a... Hand Axe of Anti-Magic that I was dumping my weapon enchants into. It's at +5/+5 now. Anti-Magic sounded rare, but IDK what to do with this thing. Is it worth continuing investment for the brand?

Partial Dump-
[spoiler]
  Code:
Amadine the Unseen (Naga Artificer)
HP  97/146       AC 12     Str 13      XL: 15   Next: 44%
MP  31/31        EV 19     Int  8 (13) God: Nemelex Xobeh [******]
Gold 846         SH 18     Dex 18      Spells:  0 memorised, 14 levels left

rFire  . . .     SeeInvis +     h - +9,+8 morningstar of Midnight {speed, *Rage +Blink SInv}
rCold  . . .     Rnd*Rage +     l - +2 robe
rNeg   . . .     Conserve .     u - -2 shield
rPois  +         rCorr    .     q - +1 helmet {SInv}
rElec  .         rRot     .     J - -1 cloak
SustAb . .       Spirit   .     j - +1 pair of gloves
rMut   .         Warding  .     (no barding)
Gourm  +         Stasis   .     e - amulet of the gourmand
MR     ++...                    x - ring of protection from magic
                                s - +5 ring of evasion

   Skills:
 + Level 12.8 Fighting
 - Level 8.5 Maces & Flails
 - Level 7.7 Dodging
 - Level 16.9 Stealth
 - Level 5.6 Shields
 - Level 14.6 Evocations
[/spoiler][/spoiler]
Last edited by requerent on Monday, 12th May 2014, 00:39, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar

Blades Runner

Posts: 614

Joined: Tuesday, 31st December 2013, 19:51

Post Sunday, 11th May 2014, 03:41

Re: CIP: NaAr, Nemelex

You don't need to hide your dump behind spoilers~ And usually the only part people leave out is the game history.

Lair is quite easy, especially with poison resistance, spit poison, deck spam, and level 15. Don't get surrounded though.

M&F is a good weapon category in general. That morningstar is not a bad weapon for now, although it'd help to see what other options you've accumulated so far.

hand-axe is the weakest of axes. Anti-magic is a powerful brand, but with such a weak base weapon it was not really worth the investment! D: Plus, seeing as how you've found a good morningstar for now, you should just stick to training that (and stashed away the ?ofEW somewhere safe)

The morningstar is not end-game material, but don't worry about that, demon whips litter the lower bounds of the dungeon.

Since you're in a robe, dodging will give much better returns than AC. Higher dex helps your evasion out a fair bit, much more so with high dodging skill.

You can never have too much evocations! If you're playing Nemelex, at least. (I don't have much experience with the Trickster, but he's a very strong god; Triple Draw is a powerful offense with DoD, and Stack 5 helps you mill a deck of Wonders safely).

There is no such thing as "too much stealth" but if you aren't going to pick up a short blade and stab guys with it there's not much point to training it farther. 17 stealth is more than sufficient to avoid ordinary detection for the most part. (Thrashing an unaware foe will still give you a small bonus to damage anyway)

Weapon delay is reduced by 1 for every 2 levels in the weapon skill. If I have a cutlass (delay 12, min-delay 5) then I'll need 14 levels in short blades to get it to minimum delay. But there's no rush; train up your defences first.
114491 | Pan | Entered the realm of Gloorx Vloq.
114491 | Pan | Noticed Gloorx Vloq
114492 | Pan | Killed Gloorx Vloq

true lords of shadow NEVER sleep

Barkeep

Posts: 3890

Joined: Wednesday, 14th August 2013, 23:25

Location: USA

Post Sunday, 11th May 2014, 05:32

Re: CIP: NaAr, Nemelex

The problem with that morningstar is the *Rage attribute, which makes you randomly berserk while engaged in melee. That might sound nice, but if it triggers at the wrong time it can kill you, as being berserk blocks all actions except attacking, moving, butchering, and eating. You can suppress *Rage through an amulet of stasis or the clarity attribute, or by just staying at very hungry or less as much as possible (though that is really annoying so I wouldn't do it, having fun is #1). But anyway if you do manage to suppress the *Rage, a +8 morningstar of speed is totally an endgame-worthy weapon.

Hand axes are terrible.

You haven't put so much into shields that you would be locked into one-handers yet. I'd probably not put any more into shields until you know for sure that your best weapon available at least for a good while is one-handed.

I'd get more weapon skill and dodging. But, assuming that *rage can't be worked around, I'd need to know what other weapons are available to advise you on your choice there.

Barkeep

Posts: 3890

Joined: Wednesday, 14th August 2013, 23:25

Location: USA

Post Sunday, 11th May 2014, 05:32

Re: CIP: NaAr, Nemelex

Oh jesus you have two acquirement scrolls? Acquire a weapon. Problem solved. (Missed where you said that.)

Hoarding ?acquirement is bad. How often have you died with unused strategic scrolls? If the answer is, "More often than I've won," this should point to the flawed logic of hoarding scrolls of acquirement.

Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Tuesday, 6th May 2014, 01:19

Post Sunday, 11th May 2014, 05:37

Re: CIP: NaAr, Nemelex

and into wrote:Oh jesus you have two acquirement scrolls? Acquire a weapon. Problem solved. (Missed where you said that.)

Hoarding ?acquirement is bad. How often have you died with unused strategic scrolls? If the answer is, "More often than I've won," this should point to the flawed logic of hoarding scrolls of acquirement.



Lol-- this is my first game finding one (I'm good at RLs, but new to Crawl). Honestly though, I don't have a weapon skill- won't acquirement just give me something random, potentially useless?

Will armors/rods do me better? I've got 3 acquirements now.


Updated the OP to reflect current progress.

Barkeep

Posts: 3890

Joined: Wednesday, 14th August 2013, 23:25

Location: USA

Post Sunday, 11th May 2014, 05:58

Re: CIP: NaAr, Nemelex UPDATE

You have 8.5 M&F, so it will most likely give you a mace/flail category weapon, though this is not guaranteed. Even if it gives you a different weapon, you aren't so invested in M&F that you could not switch to whatever it is. Weapons from acquirement tend to be good, their quality is not influenced by your skills, just their category—long blade, short blade, etc.

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