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I repeated the tests. Quaffed a potion of haste/might before the fight, potion of curing at 49 HP. Won with 40/112 HP. Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15-a0-658-g449be1d (tiles) character file. DEFE the Eclecticist (Deep Elf Venom Mage) Turns: 1929, Time: 00:16:06 HP 40/112 AC 15 Str 9 (10) XL: ...

duvessa wrote:
tabstorm wrote:all this thread is saying is that a DE with no melee skill at all
and no spells

Let us assume that our MP has been drained fully before damaging the enemy in any way

you can kill a ghost moth OK with an XL 16-17 DE. i just built one in wizmode with like 12 fighting, 15 dodging, 12 staves, 11 fire/conj, 7 sc, he had about 15/22 and a +0 laj of slicing and was able to kill a ghost moth in melee with buffs, assuming no invis, sinv, etc. i could probably fit more fi...

Yred is really good in late game (Depths + Zot). Leaving gods was always dumb in *most* cases even before the wrath change, and most advice I've read about leaving this or that god because they "drop off in power" was merely a reflection of bad tendencies for OCD min-maxing and armchair s...

Yred is really good in late game (Depths + Zot). Leaving gods was always dumb in *most* cases even before the wrath change, and most advice I've read about leaving this or that god because they "drop off in power" was merely a reflection of bad tendencies for OCD min-maxing and armchair s...

As was noted above god wrath has been buffed recently, furthermore vehumet's powers are highly useful for characters that cast lots of conjurations so there isn't really a good reason to leave.

Your position dosen't matter as much, but on a character with little to no melee skill you need to be able to assess how much MP you need for a given encounter and whether you can win it with how much you have, and then how to get out of said encounter, so the cosiderations are different and may/may...

Hitting zd zd zd repeatedly for fireball can be considered just as boring, furthermore you don't need to even move and there are fewer positional considerations. I think it's the sort of thing that a bot would struggle with to some extent even if it's relatively easy for a player.

I generally play DE casters in a similar fashion because it's more enjoyable, and I never seem to have these issues with mana management that everyone else talks about, but regardless, "pure" casters are considered suboptimal generally speaking, and also many players find interaction with ...

@Sandman25 I think everyone else is assuming a "properly" played DE caster something along the lines of: 1. Get enough skill to use your level 4 spell to get you through early game 2. Take dex on level ups and maybe str for carrying capacity, no int 3. Maybe train a bit more magic for a le...

nice list OP i think you didn't go far enough though. imo we also need to: remove all runes except the 2 main lair runes and silver rune (The other branches are problematic and/or boring) remove gods (They limit player choice by being mind-bogglingly overpowered) remove magic (Extremely overpowered,...

What is the connection between stabbing, high scores and Elf? I'm lost. If you are aiming for, for instance, a racial highscore, it's often beneficial to go to Elf at a low XP level, since the XP and items you gain there may help you to go through the remainder of the game faster. A character like ...

It's actually the other way around. If you want to maximize your high score, you ignore Elf and sometimes even Orcish Mines because they don't have runes. I would disagree if you are playing only to get the highest score possible and are something other than a stabber. <Patashu> !hs * recent -log <...

Sandman25 wrote:It's actually the other way around. If you want to maximize your high score, you ignore Elf and sometimes even Orcish Mines because they don't have runes.

I would disagree if you are playing only to get the highest score possible and are something other than a stabber.

I would definitely find this spell convenient.

That is exactly what gods do. A HuFi goes "otabotabotab crap an orc wizard time to use tactics." A HuBe goes "otabotabotab crap an orc wizard time to press aa then otab some more." Even a god with absolutely no restrictions removes choices through the simple act of giving you us...

Please show that there exists a dangerous situation, that could not have been avoided by application of foresight, barring you burning all your consumables or being afflicted with -tele, where it is better to stand put and utilize cleaving rather than use a teleport or blink or flee. I don't think ...

If you are fighting in such a situation you probably should have used tele 3 turns ago. It is not always possible. I hope I don't need to elaborate. Please show that there exists a dangerous situation, that could not have been avoided by application of foresight, barring you burning all your consum...

In most situations after early game you don't want to teleport or blink anyway Why is that? I use tele/blink in the midgame (I may just be bad). I suppose in theory you could get a bad tele so in some sense you are incurring more risk, but I don't think I've died to a bad tele. Certainly I think it...

I die often surrounded so cleaving is very good for me. I don't overestimate rings of slaying since misses happen often. ?????????? I feel like am I talking to Bizarro at this point. Slaying is good because misses happen often. Cleaving is bad because being surrounded makes you die. Maybe I am writ...

Well, my last game just had 3, although I died there more due to playing extremely carelessly than anything else. However I feel like they have definitely become much more common there...

Question: Is at least one ancient lich now guaranteed on V:5?

I feel like the past several games I have watched/played have all had at least one.

started the whole "roguelike" thing with elona, then in a roguelike thread on another board heard talk about crawl and tried it. this was around the time of the 0.13 tourney.

Mediocre base damage relative to XP investment and cleaving isn't that strong tactically for the following reason: Against a non-dangerous mob you can just hit tab a few more times and still be fine. Against a dangerous one, you ideally don't want to be in a position such that multiple dangerous ene...

If you have ctele, tele to one of the outer corners of the vaults after using mmap. You can also run partway down the hall and stand somewhere in the middle when you fight the welcoming party, it may or may not make enough noise to bring the enemies in the quadrants out to attack you. Personally, I ...

Get vamp drain usable, take kiku, animate every corpse you find. Once vdrain is usable you should turn on melee skills.

Yeah Tabstorm, you identified the two big strategic errors. I never even cast XXX, so it was a huge waste of spell levels, and while recall can be handy I could've gotten most of the same utility by just recasting summons. Mana vipers are actually pretty useful late into the game, since that antima...

Your char looks mostly OK except I think I think the usefulness of manavipers, recall, and beastly appendage are dubious. you could have instead had haste if it existed, or had room for necromutation, I'm not sure what you would be casting that at. With that said, Zot would be a better place to go t...

Regarding the As background, it's not really a stealth background, even though the class descriptions says "Assassins are all about stealth" - though you do start with XP in stealth, I think this is a little misleading, because as has been discussed in this thread, you are not really goin...

Dagger of venom sucks too. Have you been checking all branded shortblades? What you really want is electrocution or pain. For pain i need Necromancy skill to be effective and electrocution too noisy, isn't it? What Sar said (though he could have been nicer about it). Even 10 necromancy (the more th...

Regarding the As background, it's not really a stealth background, even though the class descriptions says "Assassins are all about stealth" - though you do start with XP in stealth, I think this is a little misleading, because as has been discussed in this thread, you are not really going...

I sort of agree that if you attempt to play a character that relies on stabbing to kill everything, if you do not have some hexes, or at least needles, you will not have a fun time, especially if you are not a spriggan. In principle you can just avoid everything that wakes up on such a character, ho...

Don't branch out to weapons, UC has high base damage as you continue to train it, especially with hero and even more so with blade hands and slaying. Use hero in basically every fight. For spells, you want your usual level 1-3 utilities (regen, rmsl, apport, blink, butterflies, etc.) along with blad...

Train more fighting and dodging for now, ideally you want to get at least 10 in both by the end of Lair.

It has a few uses past very early D but mostly these are limited to speed runs where risk isn't as much of a consideration (like tomb:3)

Can someone just explain the ability to win the game purely through stabbing at XL10...especially if you are not leveling stealth first. When you get into the point of the game where everything you meet: -Can see Invisible -Resists all your Hexes -Never Sleeps -Immediately notices you even with max...

Skills look mostly OK. I think HE is more naturally played with lightweight armor and more focus on EV in the early-mid game. in a leather armour with all your aux slots filled, for instance, you could have like 10/23 vs. 16/8, or in a ring mail probably something like 12/17. I don't like chain mail...

If you're already skilled in maces just stick with the elec demon whip, then, when you mentioned a battleaxe I had assumed you had invested in axes.

Might be from a lot of resting, but regardless, you should wield the vamp battleaxe, hunger cost is a minor drawback compared to the utility of Vamp.

I think the best choice is a moderate-weight dragon armour (up to fire/ice/pearl), same as for any character.

There is a general guide to SpEn on the knowledge bot: http://crawl.develz.org/info/index.php?q=hyperbolic though this will be out of date in trunk due to the nerfing of the En book. When I played the character I basically followed that guide, except I took dex instead of int, and used Kiku to impro...

It's probably not necessarily patience you need to learn, but better threat assessment and/or tactics. From watching your tv, it seems that you made an error in choosing to read fog, when on 37 hp, as airstrike does 1d50, since reading fog is not the most reliable thing ever as an escape tool. since...

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