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ID Category Severity Reproducibility Date Submitted Last Update
0007396 [DCSS] Patches minor have not tried 2013-07-26 17:59 2014-02-11 17:49
Reporter chris View Status public  
Assigned To
Priority normal Resolution suspended  
Status closed   Product Branch 0.13 ancient branch
Summary 0007396: Monster speed
Description Aim: Drastically reduce amount of monsters with speed 9 or 11

Due to the "monster speed" vs. "player delay" inconsistencies, speed 11 doesn't matter at all in practice. Some monsters currently on 11 were upgraded to 12, others down to 10 based on my personal experience and preference.

As for why I dislike monster speed 9: it's functionally equivalent to speed 8 (i.e. normal speed characters can kite the thing in question endlessly) but at least makes this not take as long. Excerpt from the "guardian mummy" commit message:
    While encouraging kiting sucks, it is a mechanic players should learn
    about. This e.g. means that the guardian mummy ossuary gives enough
    reasons on its own why guardian mummies cannot be speed 10.
    So let's at least make the kiting not take hours, same justification
    applies to spiny worms for instance.

Note that in cases where i don't find the possibility of kiting adds anything to the monster experience, they were upgraded to speed 10 (smoke demon and starspawn).

Pre-patch praise: <dev> speed 9 and speed 11 are dumb

First batch: [^] (git am on the 'raw' file)
* Change azure jelly speed to 12 (was: 11)
* Change balrug speed to 12 (was: 11)
* Change speed of some '2' tier demons to 10 (was: 11)
* Change crab monster speed to 10 (was: 11)
* Change eidolon speed to 10 (was: 11)
* Change swamp drake speed to 10 (was: 11)
* Change chaos spawn speed to 10 (was: 11)

Second batch: [^] (git am on the 'raw' file)
* Speed 10 for smoke demons (was: 9)
* Speed 10 for tentacled starspawns (was: 9)
* Speed 8 for guardian mummies (was: 9)
* Speed 8 for spiny worms (was: 9)
* Speed 8 for snapping turtles (was: 9)

Changes to jellies (either speed 10 or 8, I strongly prefer 10) will be in an own patch and ticket because those most likely will stir up some.
Tengu rules are also silly as hell, but (as with the unused `felid` monster) I'm not touching those in the interest of constructive discussion for the other changes made.

I'm interested in whether you think the decisions about up- or downgrading make sense as well as general feedback on the "speed 9/11" issue. Some (not all) of the commits above contain more detailed information in their commit messages, so check out the actual patchset by clicking on "raw" at bpaste.
Additional Information
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Attached Files

- Relationships
related to 0008138closedsgrunt Monster speed 

-  Notes
KiloByte (manager)
2013-07-26 19:52

I'd say this is a bad idea, at least for any monster that has a spell or a special ability that takes time.

No such monster is effectively at its apparent speed. So you alter the balance for no reason, including bumping monsters who are already prominent (smoke demons have both sticky and smiting). Changing the speed of a spellcaster from 11 to 12 is quite meaningful.
chris (updater)
2013-07-29 17:34

Okay so the current state is that some of those were squashed into a commit with the wrong author and the wrong commit message (speed 9 is not a change).

* e89d11f 2013-07-26 Adam Borowski Make spiny worms, snapping turtles, guardian mummies speed 9 (ChrisOelmueller)

Thanks for the attribution but i'd prefer keeping authorship on patches intact next time. Do i now proceed to find other devs agreeing with the changes in other files?
KiloByte (manager)
2013-08-27 11:40

chris: "squashed" or "wrong commit message" would imply some original patch was used. This is a matter of arbitrary changes to a single number, something not really patch worthy unless there's enough to make tracking tedious. Also, that "wrong commit message" actually explained things (besides applying to a different set of monsters).

Is there anything else left to do? If not, this bug can be closed.

- Issue History
Date Modified Username Field Change
2013-07-26 17:59 chris New Issue
2013-07-26 19:52 KiloByte Note Added: 0023570
2013-07-29 17:34 chris Note Added: 0023589
2013-08-27 11:40 KiloByte Note Added: 0023880
2014-02-11 17:49 chris Status new => closed
2014-02-11 17:49 chris Resolution open => suspended
2014-02-11 20:40 sgrunt Relationship added related to 0008138

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